From sh162551@sac.sfbay.sun.com Wed Jul 16 00:34:51 2008 Received: from sunmail4.singapore.sun.com (sunmail4.Singapore.Sun.COM [129.158.71.19]) by sac.sfbay.sun.com (8.13.8+Sun/8.13.8) with ESMTP id m6G7YoJg013898 for ; Wed, 16 Jul 2008 00:34:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nwk-avmta-2.sfbay.sun.com (nwk-avmta-2.SFBay.Sun.COM [129.145.155.6]) by sunmail4.singapore.sun.com (8.13.4+Sun/8.13.3/ENSMAIL,v2.2) with ESMTP id m6G7Yi7E002104; Wed, 16 Jul 2008 15:34:49 +0800 (SGT) Received: from pmxchannel-daemon.nwk-avmta-2.sfbay.sun.com by nwk-avmta-2.sfbay.sun.com (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-3.04 (built Jul 15 2005)) id <0K4300J01921BE00@nwk-avmta-2.sfbay.sun.com>; Wed, 16 Jul 2008 00:34:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dm-sfbay-01.sfbay.sun.com ([129.145.155.118]) by nwk-avmta-2.sfbay.sun.com (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-3.04 (built Jul 15 2005)) with ESMTP id <0K4300FNB9204470@nwk-avmta-2.sfbay.sun.com>; Wed, 16 Jul 2008 00:34:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sac.sfbay.sun.com (new-sac.SFBay.Sun.COM [129.146.175.65]) by dm-sfbay-01.sfbay.sun.com (8.13.8+Sun/8.13.8/ENSMAIL,v2.2) with ESMTP id m6G7YlDI024382; Wed, 16 Jul 2008 00:34:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sac.sfbay.sun.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by sac.sfbay.sun.com (8.13.8+Sun/8.13.8) with ESMTP id m6G7YjMe013865; Wed, 16 Jul 2008 00:34:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from sh162551@localhost) by sac.sfbay.sun.com (8.13.8+Sun/8.13.8/Submit) id m6G7YjaG013861; Wed, 16 Jul 2008 00:34:45 -0700 (PDT) Date: Wed, 16 Jul 2008 00:34:45 -0700 (PDT) From: Shi-Ying Irene Huang Subject: avant-window-navigator for OpenSolaris [LSARC/2008/452 FastTrack timeout 07/22/2008] To: lsarc-ext@sun.com Cc: hua.zhang@sun.com Message-id: <200807160734.m6G7YjaG013861@sac.sfbay.sun.com> Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-PMX-Version: 5.4.1.325704 Status: RO Content-Length: 9274 Template Version: @(#)sac_nextcase 1.66 04/17/08 SMI This information is Copyright 2008 Sun Microsystems 1. Introduction 1.1. Project/Component Working Name: avant-window-navigator for OpenSolaris 1.2. Name of Document Author/Supplier: Author: Henry Zhang 1.3 Date of This Document: 16 July, 2008 4. Technical Description 1. Introduction 1.1. Project/Component Working Name: Avant-window-navigator 1.2. Name of Document Author/Supplier: Henry Zhang (hua.zhang@sun.com) 1.3. Date of This Document: 10/07/08 1.4. Name of Major Document Customer(s)/Consumer(s): 1.4.1. The PAC or CPT you expect to review your project: Solaris PAC 1.4.2. The ARC(s) you expect to review your project: LSARC 1.4.3. The Director/VP who is "Sponsoring" this project: Robert.Odea@Sun.Com 1.4.4. The name of your business unit: JDS Desktop Engineering, OPG 1.5. Email Aliases: 1.5.1. Responsible Manager: leo.binchy@Sun.COM 1.5.2. Responsible Engineer: hua.zhang@Sun.COM 1.5.3. Marketing Manager: jeff.mcmeekin@sun.com 1.5.4. Interest List: awn@sun.com 2. Project Summary 2.1. Project Description: Avant Window Navigator (AWN/Awn) is a dock-like navigation bar for the desktop. 2.2. Risks and Assumptions: 1. Through the preferences of AWN, AWN manager, user can add new applets, which is developed by third-party or someone, but they are not stable or missing some dependencies required to run , so may cause some error. So if user like to add new applets, should go to Applet Gallery, and install the stable ones. If someone develop the applet for AWN, should follow Applet Submission at http://wiki.awn-project.org/Awn_Extras:Applet_Submission 3. Business Summary 3.1. Problem Area: Now all of the Operating System is providing the desktop tool for user to view and control system, user can start many applications in the system, so it's useful to provide user a GUI tool to list all of the running applications, and user can use it to active/deactive the application or access some location by simply click one icon. Avant Window Navigator (Awn) is just this type of tool, it looks very cool, and really provide user great convenience to manage the running applications. 3.2. Market/Requester: JDS Desktop group 3.3. Business Justification: Avant Window Navigator (Awn) is a dock-like bar which sits at the bottom of the screen. It has support for launchers, task lists, and third party applets. So it can provide user an easy way to track the opened windows, and user can launch some location by simply click some launcher, user also can add applets, and set the theme to make AWN looks very cool. 3.4. Competitive Analysis: Mac OS has leopard Dock. 3.5. Opportunity Window/Exposure: It is expected that this project will be integrated into Nevada B99. 3.6. How will you know when you are done?: When it is ported to Nevada and runs correctly. The project will be complete when there are no stoppers, P1 or P2 bugs. 4. Technical Description: 4.1. Details: Avant Window Navigator (AWN/Awn) is a dock-like navigation bar for the linux desktop that positions itself at the bottom of the screen. It can be used to keep track of open windows and behaves like a normal window list, you can also add a place or location (home folder or a drive for example) to the dock. So to make you have control of your computer just from the dock. AWN is a dock-like bar which sits at the bottom of you screen, allowing you to launch and control applications. Also has the ability to embed external applets. Look and feel are fully customisable, and theming support is also available. AWN ships with only the Launcher/Taskmanager applet. Many other applets, such as the Main Menu, "Stacks", CPU meter, and GMail notifier applets can be found in Awn Extras. Once you have installed some applets, you can add them to the dock via awn-manager, in the "Applets" section. User also can develop plugin for AWN, which allow already-existing applications to interact with AWN. Awn Extras is a project focusing on providing a number of important applets (not unlike the panel applets for Gnome and Xfce) in a single package, along with a number of plugins that allow applications to better interface with Awn's task manager. These applets range from a Trash applet to fancy workspace switcher. To obtain them, follow the Awn Extras download instructions. You will find the plugins in /awn-extras/awn-plugins. 4.2. Bug/RFE Number(s): N/A 4.3. In Scope: The applets included into the core distribution of AWN 4.4. Out of Scope: Applets developed by third party developers. 4.5. Interfaces: Imported Interfaces Interface Stability Comments ------------------- ----------- ----------------------------------- X11 libraries & protocols Standard ASARC 1995/265, PSARC 1998/299 libXrender.so.1 External dbus Volatile LSARC/2006/368 libXdamage External LSARC/2003/506 libXcomposite Volatile PSARC/2007/240 gnome-python2-gconf Uncommitted LSARC/2005/506 gnome-python-desktop Volatile LSARC/2006/202 Python Volatile PSARC/2005/532, PSARC/2006/290 PSARC/2006/290 GNOME Committed Platform Libraries Committed LSARC/2007/520 GTK+ library GNOME 2.20 Exported Interfaces Stability Comments ------------------------- ------------- --------------------------------- /usr/bin/awn-applet-activation Volatile /usr/bin/avant-window-navigator Volatile /usr/bin/awn-launcher-editor Volatile /usr/bin/awn-manager Volatile /usr/bin/awn-schema-to-gconf Volatile SUNWavant Uncommitted Package name SUNWavant-devel Uncommitted Package name SUNWavant-root Uncommitted Package name 4.6. Doc Impact: Man page will need to be added 4.7. Admin/Config Impact: There are no changes to the system administration and configuration. 4.8. HA Impact: N/A 4.9. I18N/L10N Impact: To be needed 4.10. Packaging & Delivery: The new packages are: - SUNWavant - SUNWavant-devel - SUNWavant-root 4.11. Security Impact: There is no additional security impact for Solaris. 4.12. Dependencies: libwnck-1.0 gnome-desktop-2.0 libgnome-2.0 gnome-vfs-2.0 gconf-2.0 x11 xproto dbus-glib-1 libglade-2.0 xdamage xcomposite xrender python2.5-dev python-gnome2-dev python-gnome2-desktop-dev python-gnome2-extras-dev 5. Reference Documents: Avant Window Navigator main project page: http://launchpad.net/awn Avant Window Navigator Wiki: http://wiki.awn-project.org/ Avant Window Navigator Forum: http://www.planetblur.org/hosted/awnforum 6. Resources and Schedule: 6.1. Projected Availability: Expect to integrated into Nevada in build 99 in Q3 2008 6.2. Cost of Effort: Development 1.0 Engineers - 1 Months Testing 0.5 Engineers - 1 Week RE 0.5 Engineers - 1 Week 6.3. Cost of Capital Resources: N/A 6.4. Product Approval Committee requested information: 6.4.1. Consolidation or Component Name: JDS / OpenSolaris 6.4.3. Type of CPT Review and Approval expected: Standard 6.4.4. Project Boundary Conditions: None 6.4.5. Is this a necessary project for OEM agreements: No 6.4.6. Notes: N/A 6.4.7. Target RTI Date/Release: Nevada B99 - August 2008 6.4.8. Target Code Design Review Date: August 2008 6.4.9. Update approval addition: New project, no Solaris PAC approval yet 6.5. ARC review type: FastTrack 7. Prototype Availability: 7.1. Prototype Availability: August 2008 7.2. Prototype Cost: 1 engineer 1 QA 1 RE 6. Resources and Schedule 6.4. Steering Committee requested information 6.4.1. Consolidation C-team Name: Desktop 6.5. ARC review type: FastTrack 6.6. ARC Exposure: open From James.McPherson@Sun.COM Wed Jul 16 00:47:04 2008 Received: from sunmail4.singapore.sun.com (sunmail4.Singapore.Sun.COM [129.158.71.19]) by sac.sfbay.sun.com (8.13.8+Sun/8.13.8) with ESMTP id m6G7l35o014073 for ; Wed, 16 Jul 2008 00:47:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nwk-avmta-2.sfbay.sun.com (nwk-avmta-2.SFBay.Sun.COM [129.145.155.6]) by sunmail4.singapore.sun.com (8.13.4+Sun/8.13.3/ENSMAIL,v2.2) with ESMTP id m6G7l2Kq007032 for <@sunmail2sca.sfbay.sun.com:lsarc-ext@sun.com>; Wed, 16 Jul 2008 15:47:03 +0800 (SGT) Received: from pmxchannel-daemon.nwk-avmta-2.sfbay.sun.com by nwk-avmta-2.sfbay.sun.com (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-3.04 (built Jul 15 2005)) id <0K4300J019MEWO00@nwk-avmta-2.sfbay.sun.com> for lsarc-ext@sun.com (ORCPT lsarc-ext@sun.com); Wed, 16 Jul 2008 00:47:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sineb-mail-2.sun.com ([192.18.19.7]) by nwk-avmta-2.sfbay.sun.com (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-3.04 (built Jul 15 2005)) with ESMTP id <0K4300FNA9MC4670@nwk-avmta-2.sfbay.sun.com> for lsarc-ext@sun.com (ORCPT lsarc-ext@sun.com); Wed, 16 Jul 2008 00:47:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: from fe-apac-05.sun.com (fe-apac-05.sun.com [192.18.19.176] (may be forged)) by sineb-mail-2.sun.com (8.13.6+Sun/8.12.9) with ESMTP id m6G7m6X4002926 for ; Wed, 16 Jul 2008 07:48:06 +0000 (GMT) Received: from conversion-daemon.mail-apac.sun.com by mail-apac.sun.com (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) id <0K43007019IGMQ00@mail-apac.sun.com> (original mail from James.McPherson@Sun.COM) for lsarc-ext@sun.com (ORCPT lsarc-ext@sun.com); Wed, 16 Jul 2008 15:46:30 +0800 (SGT) Received: from [192.168.1.10] ([220.157.71.44]) by mail-apac.sun.com (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTPSA id <0K43003HJ9LEJPOR@mail-apac.sun.com>; Wed, 16 Jul 2008 15:46:29 +0800 (SGT) Date: Wed, 16 Jul 2008 17:46:59 +1000 From: "James C. McPherson" Subject: Re: avant-window-navigator for OpenSolaris [LSARC/2008/452 FastTrack timeout 07/22/2008] In-reply-to: <200807160734.m6G7YjaG013861@sac.sfbay.sun.com> Sender: James.McPherson@Sun.COM To: Shi-Ying Irene Huang Cc: lsarc-ext@Sun.COM, Hua.Zhang@Sun.COM Reply-to: James.McPherson@Sun.COM Message-id: <487DA773.6020504@Sun.COM> Organization: Sun Microsystems MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=UTF-8 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-PMX-Version: 5.4.1.325704 References: <200807160734.m6G7YjaG013861@sac.sfbay.sun.com> User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.14 (X11/20080616) Status: RO Content-Length: 1253 Shi-Ying Irene Huang wrote: ... > 3.3. Business Justification: > > Avant Window Navigator (Awn) is a dock-like bar which sits at the bottom of the > screen. It has support for launchers, task lists, and third party applets. > > So it can provide user an easy way to track the opened windows, and user > can launch some location by simply click some launcher, user also can add > applets, and set the theme to make AWN looks very cool. > > 3.4. Competitive Analysis: > > Mac OS has leopard Dock. Hi Irene, I'm sorry, I really do not think you've argued the business justification at all: "looks very cool" does not work for me. Did you perhaps mean to say that you want this integrated in order to provide a user experience which is comparable to that of Mac OS X or the latest bleeding edge linux desktop? How will this interact with the existing GNOME Panel? What requirements are there for applications to ensure that they behave properly with AWN? Will I have to recompile things in order to get the "stick to desktop #Z" behaviour? James C. McPherson -- Senior Kernel Software Engineer, Solaris Sun Microsystems http://blogs.sun.com/jmcp http://www.jmcp.homeunix.com/blog From Hua.Zhang@sun.com Wed Jul 16 05:24:25 2008 Received: from newsunmail1brm.central.sun.com (newsunmail1brm.Central.Sun.COM [129.147.62.245]) by sac.sfbay.sun.com (8.13.8+Sun/8.13.8) with ESMTP id m6GCOPXh020701 for ; Wed, 16 Jul 2008 05:24:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from brm-avmta-1.central.sun.com (brm-avmta-1.Central.Sun.COM [129.147.4.11]) by newsunmail1brm.central.sun.com (8.13.7+Sun/8.13.7/ENSMAIL,v2.2) with ESMTP id m6GCOO3Z057280 for <@sunmail2sca.sfbay.sun.com:lsarc-ext@sun.com>; Wed, 16 Jul 2008 06:24:24 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pmxchannel-daemon.brm-avmta-1.central.sun.com by brm-avmta-1.central.sun.com (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-3.04 (built Jul 15 2005)) id <0K4300D1ZMGN0Q00@brm-avmta-1.central.sun.com> for lsarc-ext@sun.com (ORCPT lsarc-ext@sun.com); Wed, 16 Jul 2008 06:24:23 -0600 (MDT) Received: from sineb-mail-1.sun.com ([192.18.19.6]) by brm-avmta-1.central.sun.com (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-3.04 (built Jul 15 2005)) with ESMTP id <0K4300B8PMGKYP30@brm-avmta-1.central.sun.com> for lsarc-ext@sun.com (ORCPT lsarc-ext@sun.com); Wed, 16 Jul 2008 06:24:21 -0600 (MDT) Received: from fe-apac-06.sun.com (fe-apac-06.sun.com [192.18.19.177] (may be forged)) by sineb-mail-1.sun.com (8.13.6+Sun/8.12.9) with ESMTP id m6GCOmiA006063 for ; Wed, 16 Jul 2008 12:24:48 +0000 (GMT) Received: from conversion-daemon.mail-apac.sun.com by mail-apac.sun.com (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) id <0K4300F01M6VHW00@mail-apac.sun.com> (original mail from Hua.Zhang@Sun.COM) for lsarc-ext@sun.com (ORCPT lsarc-ext@sun.com); Wed, 16 Jul 2008 20:21:59 +0800 (SGT) Received: from [129.158.217.156] by mail-apac.sun.com (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTPSA id <0K4300BBZMCNRGCK@mail-apac.sun.com>; Wed, 16 Jul 2008 20:21:59 +0800 (SGT) Date: Wed, 16 Jul 2008 20:27:42 +0800 From: Henry Zhang Subject: Re: avant-window-navigator for OpenSolaris [LSARC/2008/452 FastTrack timeout 07/22/2008] In-reply-to: <487DA773.6020504@Sun.COM> Sender: Hua.Zhang@sun.com To: james.mcpherson@sun.com Cc: Shi-Ying Irene Huang , lsarc-ext@sun.com Message-id: <487DE93E.60107@sun.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=UTF-8 Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT X-PMX-Version: 5.4.1.325704 References: <200807160734.m6G7YjaG013861@sac.sfbay.sun.com> <487DA773.6020504@Sun.COM> User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.6 (X11/20071119) Status: RO Content-Length: 2083 Hi James, Thanks for your question, I'd like to answer some of them... James C. McPherson 写道: > Shi-Ying Irene Huang wrote: > ... > > 3.3. Business Justification: >> Avant Window Navigator (Awn) is a dock-like bar which >> sits at the bottom of the screen. It has support for launchers, >> task lists, and third party applets. So it can provide >> user an easy way to track the opened windows, and user >> can launch some location by simply click some launcher, user >> also can add >> applets, and set the theme to make AWN looks very cool. >> >> 3.4. Competitive Analysis: >> >> Mac OS has leopard Dock. > > Hi Irene, > I'm sorry, I really do not think you've argued the business > justification at all: "looks very cool" does not work for me. > > Did you perhaps mean to say that you want this integrated in > order to provide a user experience which is comparable to > that of Mac OS X or the latest bleeding edge linux desktop? Yes, you are right, these 2 applications are the similar tool, and we'd like to provide our users an option to control the system. > > > How will this interact with the existing GNOME Panel? Yes, this is a good question, AWN is an opinion for user to use, it will appear only when you start it, while GNOME Panel will exist always. These 2 tools can exist at the same time, 1, we can use arrow in the Gnome Panel to make Gnome Panel minimize, 2, Generally we can make the Gnome Panel in the top of the screen, and AWN at the bottom of the screen. In fact there is no impact between them, you can use any of them to control your system. > > What requirements are there for applications to ensure that > they behave properly with AWN? Will I have to recompile things > in order to get the "stick to desktop #Z" behaviour? No, you don't need to recompile, AWN can work properly just like the Gnome Panel. > > > > James C. McPherson > -- > Senior Kernel Software Engineer, Solaris > Sun Microsystems > http://blogs.sun.com/jmcp http://www.jmcp.homeunix.com/blog From danek.duvall@sun.com Wed Jul 16 08:50:45 2008 Received: from sunmail3mpk.sfbay.sun.com (sunmail3mpk.SFBay.Sun.COM [129.146.11.52]) by sac.sfbay.sun.com (8.13.8+Sun/8.13.8) with ESMTP id m6GFojcQ024930 for ; Wed, 16 Jul 2008 08:50:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nwk-avmta-1.SFBay.Sun.COM (nwk-avmta-1.SFBay.Sun.COM [129.146.11.74]) by sunmail3mpk.sfbay.sun.com (8.13.7+Sun/8.13.7/ENSMAIL,v2.2) with ESMTP id m6GFojoL009969 for <@sunmail2sca.sfbay.sun.com:lsarc-ext@sun.com>; Wed, 16 Jul 2008 08:50:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pmxchannel-daemon.nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM by nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-3.04 (built Jul 15 2005)) id <0K4300A2ZW0J6V00@nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM> for lsarc-ext@sun.com (ORCPT lsarc-ext@sun.com); Wed, 16 Jul 2008 08:50:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dm-sfbay-01.sfbay.sun.com ([129.145.155.118]) by nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-3.04 (built Jul 15 2005)) with ESMTP id <0K43005KHW0IPO40@nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM> for lsarc-ext@sun.com (ORCPT lsarc-ext@sun.com); Wed, 16 Jul 2008 08:50:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: from zruty.sfbay.sun.com (zruty.SFBay.Sun.COM [129.146.168.40]) by dm-sfbay-01.sfbay.sun.com (8.13.8+Sun/8.13.8/ENSMAIL,v2.2) with ESMTP id m6GFodj9058069; Wed, 16 Jul 2008 08:50:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from zruty.sfbay.sun.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by zruty.sfbay.sun.com (8.14.2+Sun/8.14.2) with ESMTP id m6GFodOe001560; Wed, 16 Jul 2008 08:50:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from dduvall@localhost) by zruty.sfbay.sun.com (8.14.2+Sun/8.14.2/Submit) id m6GFodFJ001559; Wed, 16 Jul 2008 08:50:39 -0700 (PDT) Date: Wed, 16 Jul 2008 08:50:39 -0700 From: Danek Duvall Subject: Re: avant-window-navigator for OpenSolaris [LSARC/2008/452 FastTrack timeout 07/22/2008] In-reply-to: <487DE93E.60107@sun.com> To: Henry Zhang Cc: james.mcpherson@sun.com, lsarc-ext@sun.com Message-id: <20080716155039.GO15656@zruty.sfbay.sun.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline X-PMX-Version: 5.4.1.325704 References: <200807160734.m6G7YjaG013861@sac.sfbay.sun.com> <487DA773.6020504@Sun.COM> <487DE93E.60107@sun.com> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.16 (2007-06-27) Status: RO Content-Length: 752 On Wed, Jul 16, 2008 at 08:27:42PM +0800, Henry Zhang wrote: >> How will this interact with the existing GNOME Panel? > Yes, this is a good question, AWN is an opinion for user to use, it will > appear only when you start it, while GNOME Panel will exist always. These 2 > tools can exist at the same time, > 1, we can use arrow in the Gnome Panel to make Gnome Panel minimize, > 2, Generally we can make the Gnome Panel in the top of the screen, and AWN > at the bottom of the screen. > In fact there is no impact between them, you can use any of them to control > your system. Can AWN completely replace the gnome panel? Can it swallow gnome panel applets and throw up the gnome menus? Or does it live in a completely separate space? Danek From danek.duvall@sun.com Wed Jul 16 08:53:10 2008 Received: from sunmail4.singapore.sun.com (sunmail4.Singapore.Sun.COM [129.158.71.19]) by sac.sfbay.sun.com (8.13.8+Sun/8.13.8) with ESMTP id m6GFr95M025052 for ; Wed, 16 Jul 2008 08:53:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from brm-avmta-1.central.sun.com (brm-avmta-1.Central.Sun.COM [129.147.4.11]) by sunmail4.singapore.sun.com (8.13.4+Sun/8.13.3/ENSMAIL,v2.2) with ESMTP id m6GFqv4H010691 for <@sunmail2sca.sfbay.sun.com:lsarc-ext@sun.com>; Wed, 16 Jul 2008 23:53:09 +0800 (SGT) Received: from pmxchannel-daemon.brm-avmta-1.central.sun.com by brm-avmta-1.central.sun.com (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-3.04 (built Jul 15 2005)) id <0K4300403W4J0D00@brm-avmta-1.central.sun.com> for lsarc-ext@sun.com (ORCPT lsarc-ext@sun.com); Wed, 16 Jul 2008 09:53:07 -0600 (MDT) Received: from dm-sfbay-02.sfbay.sun.com ([129.146.11.31]) by brm-avmta-1.central.sun.com (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-3.04 (built Jul 15 2005)) with ESMTP id <0K4300M9SW4IXE90@brm-avmta-1.central.sun.com> for lsarc-ext@sun.com (ORCPT lsarc-ext@sun.com); Wed, 16 Jul 2008 09:53:06 -0600 (MDT) Received: from zruty.sfbay.sun.com (zruty.SFBay.Sun.COM [129.146.168.40]) by dm-sfbay-02.sfbay.sun.com (8.13.8+Sun/8.13.8/ENSMAIL,v2.2) with ESMTP id m6GFr5tq009797; Wed, 16 Jul 2008 08:53:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from zruty.sfbay.sun.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by zruty.sfbay.sun.com (8.14.2+Sun/8.14.2) with ESMTP id m6GFr53d001598; Wed, 16 Jul 2008 08:53:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from dduvall@localhost) by zruty.sfbay.sun.com (8.14.2+Sun/8.14.2/Submit) id m6GFr4g4001591; Wed, 16 Jul 2008 08:53:05 -0700 (PDT) Date: Wed, 16 Jul 2008 08:53:04 -0700 From: Danek Duvall Subject: Re: avant-window-navigator for OpenSolaris [LSARC/2008/452 FastTrack timeout 07/22/2008] In-reply-to: <200807160734.m6G7YjaG013861@sac.sfbay.sun.com> To: Shi-Ying Irene Huang Cc: lsarc-ext@sun.com, hua.zhang@sun.com Message-id: <20080716155304.GP15656@zruty.sfbay.sun.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline X-PMX-Version: 5.4.1.325704 References: <200807160734.m6G7YjaG013861@sac.sfbay.sun.com> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.16 (2007-06-27) Status: RO Content-Length: 674 On Wed, Jul 16, 2008 at 12:34:45AM -0700, Shi-Ying Irene Huang wrote: > Exported Interfaces Stability Comments > ------------------------- ------------- --------------------------------- > > /usr/bin/awn-applet-activation Volatile > /usr/bin/avant-window-navigator Volatile > /usr/bin/awn-launcher-editor Volatile > /usr/bin/awn-manager Volatile > /usr/bin/awn-schema-to-gconf Volatile Without manpages or other documentation, or any explanation, it's hard to know what each of these executables does. Can you provide some more information? Thanks, Danek From Hua.Zhang@sun.com Wed Jul 16 21:10:57 2008 Received: from sunmail4.singapore.sun.com (sunmail4.Singapore.Sun.COM [129.158.71.19]) by sac.sfbay.sun.com (8.13.8+Sun/8.13.8) with ESMTP id m6H4Au0Z022099 for ; Wed, 16 Jul 2008 21:10:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nwk-avmta-1.SFBay.Sun.COM (nwk-avmta-1.SFBay.Sun.COM [129.146.11.74]) by sunmail4.singapore.sun.com (8.13.4+Sun/8.13.3/ENSMAIL,v2.2) with ESMTP id m6H4Al2j008650 for <@sunmail2sca.sfbay.sun.com:lsarc-ext@sun.com>; Thu, 17 Jul 2008 12:10:56 +0800 (SGT) Received: from pmxchannel-daemon.nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM by nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-3.04 (built Jul 15 2005)) id <0K4400L05UA54200@nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM> for lsarc-ext@sun.com (ORCPT lsarc-ext@sun.com); Wed, 16 Jul 2008 21:10:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sineb-mail-2.sun.com ([192.18.19.7]) by nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-3.04 (built Jul 15 2005)) with ESMTP id <0K4400IGWUA34J80@nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM> for lsarc-ext@sun.com (ORCPT lsarc-ext@sun.com); Wed, 16 Jul 2008 21:10:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: from fe-apac-06.sun.com (fe-apac-06.sun.com [192.18.19.177] (may be forged)) by sineb-mail-2.sun.com (8.13.6+Sun/8.12.9) with ESMTP id m6H4BxtX012998 for ; Thu, 17 Jul 2008 04:11:59 +0000 (GMT) Received: from conversion-daemon.mail-apac.sun.com by mail-apac.sun.com (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) id <0K4400E01TYD5000@mail-apac.sun.com> (original mail from Hua.Zhang@Sun.COM) for lsarc-ext@sun.com (ORCPT lsarc-ext@sun.com); Thu, 17 Jul 2008 12:08:31 +0800 (SGT) Received: from [129.158.217.156] by mail-apac.sun.com (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTPSA id <0K44009GPU668AY3@mail-apac.sun.com>; Thu, 17 Jul 2008 12:08:31 +0800 (SGT) Date: Thu, 17 Jul 2008 12:14:16 +0800 From: Henry Zhang Subject: Re: avant-window-navigator for OpenSolaris [LSARC/2008/452 FastTrack timeout 07/22/2008] In-reply-to: <20080716155039.GO15656@zruty.sfbay.sun.com> Sender: Hua.Zhang@sun.com To: Danek Duvall Cc: James.McPherson@sun.com, lsarc-ext@sun.com Message-id: <487EC718.8080907@sun.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=UTF-8 Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT X-PMX-Version: 5.4.1.325704 References: <200807160734.m6G7YjaG013861@sac.sfbay.sun.com> <487DA773.6020504@Sun.COM> <487DE93E.60107@sun.com> <20080716155039.GO15656@zruty.sfbay.sun.com> User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.6 (X11/20071119) Status: RO Content-Length: 1052 Danek Duvall 写道: > On Wed, Jul 16, 2008 at 08:27:42PM +0800, Henry Zhang wrote: > >>> How will this interact with the existing GNOME Panel? >> Yes, this is a good question, AWN is an opinion for user to use, it will >> appear only when you start it, while GNOME Panel will exist always. These 2 >> tools can exist at the same time, >> 1, we can use arrow in the Gnome Panel to make Gnome Panel minimize, >> 2, Generally we can make the Gnome Panel in the top of the screen, and AWN >> at the bottom of the screen. >> In fact there is no impact between them, you can use any of them to control >> your system. > > Can AWN completely replace the gnome panel? No, I don't think so, at least no plan at the moment. >Can it swallow gnome panel > applets and throw up the gnome menus? AWN is at the bottom of the screen, so they may appear together if you set the gnome panel at the bottom too. AWN can't throw up the menu at the moment. Or does it live in a completely > separate space? It keep at the bottom of the screen. > > Danek From Hua.Zhang@sun.com Wed Jul 16 21:14:44 2008 Received: from sunmail4.singapore.sun.com (sunmail4.Singapore.Sun.COM [129.158.71.19]) by sac.sfbay.sun.com (8.13.8+Sun/8.13.8) with ESMTP id m6H4Ehp3022318 for ; Wed, 16 Jul 2008 21:14:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from brm-avmta-1.central.sun.com (brm-avmta-1.Central.Sun.COM [129.147.4.11]) by sunmail4.singapore.sun.com (8.13.4+Sun/8.13.3/ENSMAIL,v2.2) with ESMTP id m6H4EbkI009865 for <@sunmail2sca.sfbay.sun.com:lsarc-ext@sun.com>; Thu, 17 Jul 2008 12:14:42 +0800 (SGT) Received: from pmxchannel-daemon.brm-avmta-1.central.sun.com by brm-avmta-1.central.sun.com (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-3.04 (built Jul 15 2005)) id <0K4400C01UGGO800@brm-avmta-1.central.sun.com> for lsarc-ext@sun.com (ORCPT lsarc-ext@sun.com); Wed, 16 Jul 2008 22:14:40 -0600 (MDT) Received: from sineb-mail-1.sun.com ([192.18.19.6]) by brm-avmta-1.central.sun.com (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-3.04 (built Jul 15 2005)) with ESMTP id <0K44009POUGEHDA0@brm-avmta-1.central.sun.com> for lsarc-ext@sun.com (ORCPT lsarc-ext@sun.com); Wed, 16 Jul 2008 22:14:39 -0600 (MDT) Received: from fe-apac-05.sun.com (fe-apac-05.sun.com [192.18.19.176] (may be forged)) by sineb-mail-1.sun.com (8.13.6+Sun/8.12.9) with ESMTP id m6H4F7SP002516 for ; Thu, 17 Jul 2008 04:15:07 +0000 (GMT) Received: from conversion-daemon.mail-apac.sun.com by mail-apac.sun.com (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) id <0K4400901UFJSG00@mail-apac.sun.com> (original mail from Hua.Zhang@Sun.COM) for lsarc-ext@sun.com (ORCPT lsarc-ext@sun.com); Thu, 17 Jul 2008 12:14:08 +0800 (SGT) Received: from [129.158.217.156] by mail-apac.sun.com (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTPSA id <0K44003OHUFJJPPS@mail-apac.sun.com>; Thu, 17 Jul 2008 12:14:08 +0800 (SGT) Date: Thu, 17 Jul 2008 12:18:03 +0800 From: Henry Zhang Subject: Re: avant-window-navigator for OpenSolaris [LSARC/2008/452 FastTrack timeout 07/22/2008] In-reply-to: <20080716155304.GP15656@zruty.sfbay.sun.com> Sender: Hua.Zhang@sun.com To: Danek Duvall Cc: Shi-Ying Irene Huang , lsarc-ext@sun.com Message-id: <487EC7FB.8050903@sun.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=UTF-8 Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT X-PMX-Version: 5.4.1.325704 References: <200807160734.m6G7YjaG013861@sac.sfbay.sun.com> <20080716155304.GP15656@zruty.sfbay.sun.com> User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.6 (X11/20071119) Status: RO Content-Length: 1050 Danek Duvall 写道: > On Wed, Jul 16, 2008 at 12:34:45AM -0700, Shi-Ying Irene Huang wrote: > >> Exported Interfaces Stability Comments >> ------------------------- ------------- --------------------------------- >> >> /usr/bin/awn-applet-activation Volatile >> /usr/bin/avant-window-navigator Volatile >> /usr/bin/awn-launcher-editor Volatile >> /usr/bin/awn-manager Volatile >> /usr/bin/awn-schema-to-gconf Volatile > > Without manpages or other documentation, or any explanation, it's hard to > know what each of these executables does. Can you provide some more > information? Thanks for feedback on these, avant-window-navigator is used to run AWN, awn-manager is used to configure the preferences of AWN, awn-applet-activation, awn-launcher-editor and awn-schema-to-gconf used to set the applet/launcher and schema, in fact you can set them just from awn-manager, instead of running them from CLI. > > Thanks, > Danek From John.Plocher@Sun.COM Wed Jul 16 21:24:44 2008 Received: from sunmail5.uk.sun.com (sunmail5.UK.Sun.COM [129.156.85.165]) by sac.sfbay.sun.com (8.13.8+Sun/8.13.8) with ESMTP id m6H4OiNG022535 for ; Wed, 16 Jul 2008 21:24:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nwk-avmta-1.SFBay.Sun.COM (nwk-avmta-1.SFBay.Sun.COM [129.146.11.74]) by sunmail5.uk.sun.com (8.13.8+Sun/8.13.8/ENSMAIL,v2.2) with ESMTP id m6H4OhJT028253 for <@sunmail2sca.sfbay.sun.com:lsarc-ext@sun.com>; Thu, 17 Jul 2008 05:24:43 +0100 (BST) Received: from pmxchannel-daemon.nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM by nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-3.04 (built Jul 15 2005)) id <0K4400N01UX61000@nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM> for lsarc-ext@sun.com (ORCPT lsarc-ext@sun.com); Wed, 16 Jul 2008 21:24:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sca-es-mail-2.sun.com ([192.18.43.133]) by nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-3.04 (built Jul 15 2005)) with ESMTP id <0K4400IPAUX64C80@nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM> for lsarc-ext@sun.com (ORCPT lsarc-ext@sun.com); Wed, 16 Jul 2008 21:24:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: from fe-sfbay-09.sun.com ([192.18.43.129]) by sca-es-mail-2.sun.com (8.13.7+Sun/8.12.9) with ESMTP id m6H4Ogx5024334 for ; Wed, 16 Jul 2008 21:24:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: from conversion-daemon.fe-sfbay-09.sun.com by fe-sfbay-09.sun.com (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-8.04 (built Feb 28 2007)) id <0K4400901UVN1900@fe-sfbay-09.sun.com> (original mail from John.Plocher@Sun.COM) for lsarc-ext@sun.com (ORCPT lsarc-ext@sun.com); Wed, 16 Jul 2008 21:24:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [192.168.168.4] ([208.74.177.212]) by fe-sfbay-09.sun.com (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-8.04 (built Feb 28 2007)) with ESMTPSA id <0K4400IZTUX53040@fe-sfbay-09.sun.com>; Wed, 16 Jul 2008 21:24:42 -0700 (PDT) Date: Wed, 16 Jul 2008 21:24:41 -0700 From: John Plocher Subject: Re: avant-window-navigator for OpenSolaris [LSARC/2008/452 FastTrack timeout 07/22/2008] In-reply-to: <487EC7FB.8050903@sun.com> Sender: John.Plocher@Sun.COM To: Henry Zhang Cc: lsarc-ext@Sun.COM, Shi-Ying Irene Huang Message-id: <487EC989.2070905@Sun.Com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=UTF-8 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-PMX-Version: 5.4.1.325704 References: <200807160734.m6G7YjaG013861@sac.sfbay.sun.com> <20080716155304.GP15656@zruty.sfbay.sun.com> <487EC7FB.8050903@sun.com> User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.14 (Macintosh/20080421) Status: RO Content-Length: 596 Henry Zhang wrote: >> AWN can't throw up the menu at the moment. and > avant-window-navigator is used to run AWN, > awn-manager is used to configure the preferences of AWN, > awn-applet-activation, awn-launcher-editor and awn-schema-to-gconf > used to set the applet/launcher and schema, in fact you can set them > just from awn-manager, instead of running them from CLI. Why would I *ever* need to run any of these from a command line? I would expect them to be accessed via desktop GUI menus and preferences settings... Once invoked, is AWN persistent across logouts? -John From Hua.Zhang@sun.com Wed Jul 16 21:36:45 2008 Received: from sunmail5.uk.sun.com (sunmail5.UK.Sun.COM [129.156.85.165]) by sac.sfbay.sun.com (8.13.8+Sun/8.13.8) with ESMTP id m6H4ajNI022579 for ; Wed, 16 Jul 2008 21:36:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nwk-avmta-1.SFBay.Sun.COM (nwk-avmta-1.SFBay.Sun.COM [129.146.11.74]) by sunmail5.uk.sun.com (8.13.8+Sun/8.13.8/ENSMAIL,v2.2) with ESMTP id m6H4ZjSO001399 for <@sunmail2sca.sfbay.sun.com:lsarc-ext@sun.com>; Thu, 17 Jul 2008 05:36:44 +0100 (BST) Received: from pmxchannel-daemon.nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM by nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-3.04 (built Jul 15 2005)) id <0K440010JVH49T00@nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM> for lsarc-ext@sun.com (ORCPT lsarc-ext@sun.com); Wed, 16 Jul 2008 21:36:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sineb-mail-1.sun.com ([192.18.19.6]) by nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-3.04 (built Jul 15 2005)) with ESMTP id <0K4400I0NVH24M90@nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM> for lsarc-ext@sun.com (ORCPT lsarc-ext@sun.com); Wed, 16 Jul 2008 21:36:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from fe-apac-05.sun.com (fe-apac-05.sun.com [192.18.19.176] (may be forged)) by sineb-mail-1.sun.com (8.13.6+Sun/8.12.9) with ESMTP id m6H4b6DL003955 for ; Thu, 17 Jul 2008 04:37:07 +0000 (GMT) Received: from conversion-daemon.mail-apac.sun.com by mail-apac.sun.com (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) id <0K4400M01VEZR100@mail-apac.sun.com> (original mail from Hua.Zhang@Sun.COM) for lsarc-ext@sun.com (ORCPT lsarc-ext@sun.com); Thu, 17 Jul 2008 12:36:07 +0800 (SGT) Received: from [129.158.217.156] by mail-apac.sun.com (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTPSA id <0K4400MI4VG69V5X@mail-apac.sun.com>; Thu, 17 Jul 2008 12:36:07 +0800 (SGT) Date: Thu, 17 Jul 2008 12:40:03 +0800 From: Henry Zhang Subject: Re: avant-window-navigator for OpenSolaris [LSARC/2008/452 FastTrack timeout 07/22/2008] In-reply-to: <487EC989.2070905@Sun.Com> Sender: Hua.Zhang@sun.com To: John Plocher Cc: lsarc-ext@sun.com, Shi-Ying Irene Huang Message-id: <487ECD23.2050502@sun.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=UTF-8 Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT X-PMX-Version: 5.4.1.325704 References: <200807160734.m6G7YjaG013861@sac.sfbay.sun.com> <20080716155304.GP15656@zruty.sfbay.sun.com> <487EC7FB.8050903@sun.com> <487EC989.2070905@Sun.Com> User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.6 (X11/20071119) Status: RO Content-Length: 880 John Plocher 写道: > Henry Zhang wrote: >>> AWN can't throw up the menu at the moment. > > and > >> avant-window-navigator is used to run AWN, awn-manager is used to >> configure the preferences of AWN, >> awn-applet-activation, awn-launcher-editor and awn-schema-to-gconf >> used to set the applet/launcher and schema, in fact you can set them >> just from awn-manager, instead of running them from CLI. > > Why would I *ever* need to run any of these from a command line? I > would expect them to be accessed via desktop GUI menus and preferences > settings... Once invoked, is AWN persistent across logouts? Yes, you are right, all of these functions are presented in a desktop GUI, awn-manager, which is used to configure the preferences. I think AWN just provide another method for you to configure AWN directly through CLI... > > -John > > > > > > From James.McPherson@sun.com Wed Jul 16 21:50:17 2008 Received: from sunmail5.uk.sun.com (sunmail5.UK.Sun.COM [129.156.85.165]) by sac.sfbay.sun.com (8.13.8+Sun/8.13.8) with ESMTP id m6H4oGFH022618 for ; Wed, 16 Jul 2008 21:50:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nwk-avmta-2.sfbay.sun.com (nwk-avmta-2.SFBay.Sun.COM [129.145.155.6]) by sunmail5.uk.sun.com (8.13.8+Sun/8.13.8/ENSMAIL,v2.2) with ESMTP id m6H4oDFQ005099 for <@sunmail2sca.sfbay.sun.com:lsarc-ext@sun.com>; Thu, 17 Jul 2008 05:50:16 +0100 (BST) Received: from pmxchannel-daemon.nwk-avmta-2.sfbay.sun.com by nwk-avmta-2.sfbay.sun.com (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-3.04 (built Jul 15 2005)) id <0K4400409W3PGY00@nwk-avmta-2.sfbay.sun.com> for lsarc-ext@sun.com (ORCPT lsarc-ext@sun.com); Wed, 16 Jul 2008 21:50:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sineb-mail-1.sun.com ([192.18.19.6]) by nwk-avmta-2.sfbay.sun.com (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-3.04 (built Jul 15 2005)) with ESMTP id <0K4400KZIW3OI450@nwk-avmta-2.sfbay.sun.com> for lsarc-ext@sun.com (ORCPT lsarc-ext@sun.com); Wed, 16 Jul 2008 21:50:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from fe-apac-06.sun.com (fe-apac-06.sun.com [192.18.19.177] (may be forged)) by sineb-mail-1.sun.com (8.13.6+Sun/8.12.9) with ESMTP id m6H4oeo1004767 for ; Thu, 17 Jul 2008 04:50:40 +0000 (GMT) Received: from conversion-daemon.mail-apac.sun.com by mail-apac.sun.com (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) id <0K4400K01VYERN00@mail-apac.sun.com> (original mail from James.McPherson@Sun.COM) for lsarc-ext@sun.com (ORCPT lsarc-ext@sun.com); Thu, 17 Jul 2008 12:47:51 +0800 (SGT) Received: from [192.168.1.10] ([220.157.71.44]) by mail-apac.sun.com (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTPSA id <0K44009OJVZO8FCT@mail-apac.sun.com>; Thu, 17 Jul 2008 12:47:51 +0800 (SGT) Date: Thu, 17 Jul 2008 14:50:12 +1000 From: "James C. McPherson" Subject: Re: avant-window-navigator for OpenSolaris [LSARC/2008/452 FastTrack timeout 07/22/2008] In-reply-to: <487EC718.8080907@sun.com> Sender: James.McPherson@sun.com To: Henry Zhang Cc: Danek Duvall , lsarc-ext@sun.com Reply-to: James.McPherson@sun.com Message-id: <487ECF84.8050008@Sun.COM> Organization: Sun Microsystems MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=UTF-8 Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT X-PMX-Version: 5.4.1.325704 References: <200807160734.m6G7YjaG013861@sac.sfbay.sun.com> <487DA773.6020504@Sun.COM> <487DE93E.60107@sun.com> <20080716155039.GO15656@zruty.sfbay.sun.com> <487EC718.8080907@sun.com> User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.14 (X11/20080616) Status: RO Content-Length: 1761 Henry Zhang wrote: > > > Danek Duvall 写道: >> On Wed, Jul 16, 2008 at 08:27:42PM +0800, Henry Zhang wrote: >> >>>> How will this interact with the existing GNOME Panel? >>> Yes, this is a good question, AWN is an opinion for user to use, it >>> will appear only when you start it, while GNOME Panel will exist >>> always. These 2 tools can exist at the same time, >>> 1, we can use arrow in the Gnome Panel to make Gnome Panel minimize, >>> 2, Generally we can make the Gnome Panel in the top of the screen, >>> and AWN at the bottom of the screen. >>> In fact there is no impact between them, you can use any of them to >>> control your system. >> >> Can AWN completely replace the gnome panel? > No, I don't think so, at least no plan at the moment. > >> Can it swallow gnome panel >> applets and throw up the gnome menus? > > AWN is at the bottom of the screen, so they may appear together if you > set the gnome panel at the bottom too. > AWN can't throw up the menu at the moment. > > Or does it live in a completely >> separate space? > It keep at the bottom of the screen. You keep referring to this assumption that everybody who uses GNOME has their Panel at the top of the screen. Why do you make this assumption? One of the advantages of GNOME is, in fact, its user configurability so that we're not all forced to use the same screen layout. Can AWN be positioned on any user-selectable area of the screen, or is it restricted to just being at the bottom? It would be less than useful if AWN imposed such a restriction. Screen real estate is at a premium, especially on laptops. James C. McPherson -- Senior Kernel Software Engineer, Solaris Sun Microsystems http://blogs.sun.com/jmcp http://www.jmcp.homeunix.com/blog From Hua.Zhang@sun.com Wed Jul 16 22:28:02 2008 Received: from sunmail5.uk.sun.com (sunmail5.UK.Sun.COM [129.156.85.165]) by sac.sfbay.sun.com (8.13.8+Sun/8.13.8) with ESMTP id m6H5S1ah024875 for ; Wed, 16 Jul 2008 22:28:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nwk-avmta-1.SFBay.Sun.COM (nwk-avmta-1.SFBay.Sun.COM [129.146.11.74]) by sunmail5.uk.sun.com (8.13.8+Sun/8.13.8/ENSMAIL,v2.2) with ESMTP id m6H5Rl5i015679 for <@sunmail2sca.sfbay.sun.com:lsarc-ext@sun.com>; Thu, 17 Jul 2008 06:28:00 +0100 (BST) Received: from pmxchannel-daemon.nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM by nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-3.04 (built Jul 15 2005)) id <0K4400701XUK8X00@nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM> for lsarc-ext@sun.com (ORCPT lsarc-ext@sun.com); Wed, 16 Jul 2008 22:27:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sineb-mail-1.sun.com ([192.18.19.6]) by nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-3.04 (built Jul 15 2005)) with ESMTP id <0K4400IXZXUJ4LB0@nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM> for lsarc-ext@sun.com (ORCPT lsarc-ext@sun.com); Wed, 16 Jul 2008 22:27:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from fe-apac-05.sun.com (fe-apac-05.sun.com [192.18.19.176] (may be forged)) by sineb-mail-1.sun.com (8.13.6+Sun/8.12.9) with ESMTP id m6H5SOIE007315 for ; Thu, 17 Jul 2008 05:28:24 +0000 (GMT) Received: from conversion-daemon.mail-apac.sun.com by mail-apac.sun.com (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) id <0K4400A01XO2QS00@mail-apac.sun.com> (original mail from Hua.Zhang@Sun.COM) for lsarc-ext@sun.com (ORCPT lsarc-ext@sun.com); Thu, 17 Jul 2008 13:27:24 +0800 (SGT) Received: from [129.158.217.156] by mail-apac.sun.com (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTPSA id <0K4400M8RXTO9MWR@mail-apac.sun.com>; Thu, 17 Jul 2008 13:27:24 +0800 (SGT) Date: Thu, 17 Jul 2008 13:31:20 +0800 From: Henry Zhang Subject: Re: avant-window-navigator for OpenSolaris [LSARC/2008/452 FastTrack timeout 07/22/2008] In-reply-to: <487ECF84.8050008@Sun.COM> Sender: Hua.Zhang@sun.com To: James.McPherson@sun.com Cc: Danek Duvall , lsarc-ext@sun.com Message-id: <487ED928.8050402@sun.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=UTF-8 Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT X-PMX-Version: 5.4.1.325704 References: <200807160734.m6G7YjaG013861@sac.sfbay.sun.com> <487DA773.6020504@Sun.COM> <487DE93E.60107@sun.com> <20080716155039.GO15656@zruty.sfbay.sun.com> <487EC718.8080907@sun.com> <487ECF84.8050008@Sun.COM> User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.6 (X11/20071119) Status: RO Content-Length: 2305 James C. McPherson 写道: > Henry Zhang wrote: >> >> >> Danek Duvall 写道: >>> On Wed, Jul 16, 2008 at 08:27:42PM +0800, Henry Zhang wrote: >>> >>>>> How will this interact with the existing GNOME Panel? >>>> Yes, this is a good question, AWN is an opinion for user to use, it >>>> will appear only when you start it, while GNOME Panel will exist >>>> always. These 2 tools can exist at the same time, >>>> 1, we can use arrow in the Gnome Panel to make Gnome Panel minimize, >>>> 2, Generally we can make the Gnome Panel in the top of the screen, >>>> and AWN at the bottom of the screen. >>>> In fact there is no impact between them, you can use any of them to >>>> control your system. >>> >>> Can AWN completely replace the gnome panel? >> No, I don't think so, at least no plan at the moment. >> >>> Can it swallow gnome panel >>> applets and throw up the gnome menus? >> >> AWN is at the bottom of the screen, so they may appear together if you >> set the gnome panel at the bottom too. >> AWN can't throw up the menu at the moment. >> >> Or does it live in a completely >>> separate space? >> It keep at the bottom of the screen. > > You keep referring to this assumption that everybody who > uses GNOME has their Panel at the top of the screen. Why > do you make this assumption? One of the advantages of > GNOME is, in fact, its user configurability so that we're > not all forced to use the same screen layout. I didn't hope anyone do so, I just tell how it works at the moment. > > Can AWN be positioned on any user-selectable area of the > screen, or is it restricted to just being at the bottom? No, user can't select where AWN stand, it keep at the bottom. > > It would be less than useful if AWN imposed such a restriction. > Screen real estate is at a premium, especially on laptops. Thanks, James, in fact, I also think over the usability of this tool during I work on it, by now what I can provide is: we deliver this tool, so that Solaris user can download and install it through IPS, if he like to take some different experience, so now what we are doing is to make it ready for user to use. > > > James C. McPherson > -- > Senior Kernel Software Engineer, Solaris > Sun Microsystems > http://blogs.sun.com/jmcp http://www.jmcp.homeunix.com/blog From Irene.Huang@sun.com Sun Jul 20 23:03:13 2008 Received: from sunmail4.singapore.sun.com (sunmail4.Singapore.Sun.COM [129.158.71.19]) by sac.sfbay.sun.com (8.13.8+Sun/8.13.8) with ESMTP id m6L63C2H003035 for ; Sun, 20 Jul 2008 23:03:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nwk-avmta-2.sfbay.sun.com (nwk-avmta-2.SFBay.Sun.COM [129.145.155.6]) by sunmail4.singapore.sun.com (8.13.4+Sun/8.13.3/ENSMAIL,v2.2) with ESMTP id m6L636qR028331 for <@sunmail2sca.sfbay.sun.com:lsarc-ext@sun.com>; Mon, 21 Jul 2008 14:03:11 +0800 (SGT) Received: from pmxchannel-daemon.nwk-avmta-2.sfbay.sun.com by nwk-avmta-2.sfbay.sun.com (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-3.04 (built Jul 15 2005)) id <0K4C00911E5AHJ00@nwk-avmta-2.sfbay.sun.com> for lsarc-ext@sun.com (ORCPT lsarc-ext@sun.com); Sun, 20 Jul 2008 23:03:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sineb-mail-1.sun.com ([192.18.19.6]) by nwk-avmta-2.sfbay.sun.com (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-3.04 (built Jul 15 2005)) with ESMTP id <0K4C007QBE58XX80@nwk-avmta-2.sfbay.sun.com> for lsarc-ext@sun.com (ORCPT lsarc-ext@sun.com); Sun, 20 Jul 2008 23:03:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from fe-apac-02.sun.com (fe-apac-02.sun.com [192.18.19.173] (may be forged)) by sineb-mail-1.sun.com (8.13.6+Sun/8.12.9) with ESMTP id m6L63bsU003134 for ; Mon, 21 Jul 2008 06:03:37 +0000 (GMT) Received: from conversion-daemon.mail-apac.sun.com by mail-apac.sun.com (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) id <0K4C00B01DVKLS00@mail-apac.sun.com> (original mail from Irene.Huang@Sun.COM) for lsarc-ext@sun.com (ORCPT lsarc-ext@sun.com); Mon, 21 Jul 2008 14:02:49 +0800 (SGT) Received: from [129.158.217.138] by mail-apac.sun.com (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTPSA id <0K4C00AW7E4ODP60@mail-apac.sun.com>; Mon, 21 Jul 2008 14:02:49 +0800 (SGT) Date: Mon, 21 Jul 2008 14:03:53 +0800 From: Irene Huang Subject: Re: avant-window-navigator for OpenSolaris [LSARC/2008/452 FastTrack timeout 07/22/2008] In-reply-to: <487ECD23.2050502@sun.com> Sender: Irene.Huang@sun.com To: Henry Zhang Cc: John Plocher , lsarc-ext@sun.com, Shi-Ying Irene Huang Message-id: <1216620233.1035.42.camel@goalie> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Evolution 2.12.2 Content-type: text/plain Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT X-PMX-Version: 5.4.1.325704 References: <200807160734.m6G7YjaG013861@sac.sfbay.sun.com> <20080716155304.GP15656@zruty.sfbay.sun.com> <487EC7FB.8050903@sun.com> <487EC989.2070905@Sun.Com> <487ECD23.2050502@sun.com> Status: RO Content-Length: 1200 Hi, all Most of the discussions is related to the GUI of AWN. If there explanation of Henry is satisfying, I'll close this case on 07/22/2008. If not, please send an email before that. Thanks --Irene On Thu, 2008-07-17 at 12:40 +0800, Henry Zhang wrote: > > John Plocher 写道: > > Henry Zhang wrote: > >>> AWN can't throw up the menu at the moment. > > > > and > > > >> avant-window-navigator is used to run AWN, awn-manager is used to > >> configure the preferences of AWN, > >> awn-applet-activation, awn-launcher-editor and awn-schema-to-gconf > >> used to set the applet/launcher and schema, in fact you can set them > >> just from awn-manager, instead of running them from CLI. > > > > Why would I *ever* need to run any of these from a command line? I > > would expect them to be accessed via desktop GUI menus and preferences > > settings... Once invoked, is AWN persistent across logouts? > > Yes, you are right, all of these functions are presented in a desktop > GUI, awn-manager, which is used to configure the preferences. > I think AWN just provide another method for you to configure AWN > directly through CLI... > > > > -John > > > > > > > > > > > > From Brian.Cameron@sun.com Tue Jul 22 09:19:02 2008 Received: from sunmail3mpk.sfbay.sun.com (sunmail3mpk.SFBay.Sun.COM [129.146.11.52]) by sac.sfbay.sun.com (8.13.8+Sun/8.13.8) with ESMTP id m6MGJ23K005210 for ; Tue, 22 Jul 2008 09:19:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nwk-avmta-2.sfbay.sun.com (nwk-avmta-2.SFBay.Sun.COM [129.145.155.6]) by sunmail3mpk.sfbay.sun.com (8.13.7+Sun/8.13.7/ENSMAIL,v2.2) with ESMTP id m6MGJ1Np014849 for <@sunmail2sca.sfbay.sun.com:lsarc-ext@sun.com>; Tue, 22 Jul 2008 09:19:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pmxchannel-daemon.nwk-avmta-2.sfbay.sun.com by nwk-avmta-2.sfbay.sun.com (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-3.04 (built Jul 15 2005)) id <0K4F007011BPUY00@nwk-avmta-2.sfbay.sun.com> for lsarc-ext@sun.com (ORCPT lsarc-ext@sun.com); Tue, 22 Jul 2008 09:19:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: from brmea-mail-4.sun.com ([192.18.98.36]) by nwk-avmta-2.sfbay.sun.com (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-3.04 (built Jul 15 2005)) with ESMTP id <0K4F002X21BMPHB0@nwk-avmta-2.sfbay.sun.com> for lsarc-ext@sun.com (ORCPT lsarc-ext@sun.com); Tue, 22 Jul 2008 09:18:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: from fe-amer-09.sun.com ([192.18.109.79]) by brmea-mail-4.sun.com (8.13.6+Sun/8.12.9) with ESMTP id m6MGIw7f008688 for ; Tue, 22 Jul 2008 16:18:58 +0000 (GMT) Received: from conversion-daemon.mail-amer.sun.com by mail-amer.sun.com (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-8.04 (built Feb 28 2007)) id <0K4F00G0110PXS00@mail-amer.sun.com> (original mail from Brian.Cameron@Sun.COM) for lsarc-ext@sun.com (ORCPT lsarc-ext@sun.com); Tue, 22 Jul 2008 10:18:58 -0600 (MDT) Received: from [129.156.226.192] by mail-amer.sun.com (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-8.04 (built Feb 28 2007)) with ESMTPSA id <0K4F00BE21BHOP60@mail-amer.sun.com>; Tue, 22 Jul 2008 10:18:54 -0600 (MDT) Date: Tue, 22 Jul 2008 11:19:00 -0500 From: Brian Cameron Subject: Re: avant-window-navigator for OpenSolaris [LSARC/2008/452 FastTrack timeout 07/22/2008] In-reply-to: <200807160734.m6G7YjaG013861@sac.sfbay.sun.com> Sender: Brian.Cameron@sun.com To: Shi-Ying Irene Huang Cc: lsarc-ext@sun.com, Hua.Zhang@sun.com Message-id: <48860874.7080700@sun.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-PMX-Version: 5.4.1.325704 References: <200807160734.m6G7YjaG013861@sac.sfbay.sun.com> User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.14 (X11/20080701) Status: RO Content-Length: 5065 What is the accessibility impact of this new mechanism of accessing "applet like things"? Does this "just work" with accessibility? If not, what is our plan to make it accessible? Also, how does this relate to gDesklets? Although giving users choice to customize their desktop is a good thing, I hope we aren't going to end up with a mish-mash of random eyecandy that doesn't work well or integrate together. > 2.1. Project Description: > > Avant Window Navigator (AWN/Awn) is a dock-like navigation bar for the > desktop. > > > 2.2. Risks and Assumptions: > > 1. Through the preferences of AWN, AWN manager, user can add new applets, which > is developed by third-party or someone, but they are not stable or missing > some dependencies required to run , so may cause some error. So if > user like to add new applets, should go to Applet Gallery, and install the > stable ones. Do users need to compile code to install a new applet, or are the applets interpreted (e.g. Python code) so that users can just install an applet and it will just work without needing to do extra complicated things like compile code? > If someone develop the applet for AWN, should follow Applet > Submission at http://wiki.awn-project.org/Awn_Extras:Applet_Submission Could you give some examples of what sorts of applets are available for this framework? What applets are installed by default and what do they do? How active are third parties or individuals at creating applets? I notice the Applet Gallery you describe is here: http://wiki.awn-project.org/Applet_Gallery Which ones will we be shipping, if any? > Avant Window Navigator (AWN/Awn) is a dock-like navigation bar for the > linux desktop that positions itself at the bottom of the screen. It can > be used to keep track of open windows and behaves like a normal window > list, you can also add a place or location (home folder or a drive for > example) to the dock. So to make you have control of your computer just > from the dock. Although it does look cool, I worry that it will confuse users if we provide another interface that works very similar to gnome-panel. I would appreciate more information about what our future plans are. Will avant-window-navigator replace gnome-panel, will it be used together with gnome-panel, or is it expected that users will pick one or the other to use? Perhaps you could explain a bit how you expect users would actually use this in relation to gnome-panel. If they are intended to be used together, then is it likely that users be confused by having two sets of interfaces that do very similar things? If the intention is that users would use one or the other, then how do users pick which one to use? In GNOME we already support two window managers (metacity and compiz). Users can easily manage switching between the two because the GNOME configuration dialogs allows users to pick which one they will use. This way users are prevented from possibly trying to run both at the same time, making a more sane user experience. Is switching back and forth between gnome-panel and avant-window-navigator managed in a similar simple fashion? > AWN is a dock-like bar which sits at the bottom of you screen, allowing > you to launch and control applications. Also has the ability to embed > external applets. Look and feel are fully customisable, and theming > support is also available. > > AWN ships with only the Launcher/Taskmanager applet. Many other applets, > such as the Main Menu, "Stacks", CPU meter, and GMail notifier applets > can be found in Awn Extras. Once you have installed some applets, you > can add them to the dock via awn-manager, in the "Applets" section. > > User also can develop plugin for AWN, which allow already-existing > applications to interact with AWN. Awn Extras is a project focusing on > providing a number of important applets (not unlike the panel applets for > Gnome and Xfce) in a single package, along with a number of plugins that > allow applications to better interface with Awn's task manager. > These applets range from a Trash applet to fancy workspace switcher. > To obtain them, follow the Awn Extras download instructions. You will > find the plugins in /awn-extras/awn-plugins. Will we be integrating any of these Extra plugins with this case, or a separate case? Or are you just informing us that end users can install additional applets if they wish? If we aren't shipping any plugins with this case, how useful is avant-window-navigator? In other words, do users need to install any extra plugins for it to be really usable? > The applets included into the core distribution of AWN > > 4.4. Out of Scope: > > Applets developed by third party developers. It is not clear to me if this refers to the "Extra plugins" or not. Brian From unixconsole@yahoo.com Tue Jul 22 10:18:39 2008 Received: from sunmail5.uk.sun.com (sunmail5.UK.Sun.COM [129.156.85.165]) by sac.sfbay.sun.com (8.13.8+Sun/8.13.8) with ESMTP id m6MHIcZr009839 for ; Tue, 22 Jul 2008 10:18:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nwk-avmta-1.SFBay.Sun.COM (nwk-avmta-1.SFBay.Sun.COM [129.146.11.74]) by sunmail5.uk.sun.com (8.13.8+Sun/8.13.8/ENSMAIL,v2.2) with ESMTP id m6MHIVqh019293 for <@sunmail2sca.sfbay.sun.com:lsarc-ext@sun.com>; Tue, 22 Jul 2008 18:18:37 +0100 (BST) Received: from pmxchannel-daemon.nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM by nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-3.04 (built Jul 15 2005)) id <0K4F0000N42Y9200@nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM> for lsarc-ext@sun.com (ORCPT lsarc-ext@sun.com); Tue, 22 Jul 2008 10:18:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sca-ea-mail-4.sun.com ([192.18.43.22]) by nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-3.04 (built Jul 15 2005)) with ESMTP id <0K4F00MNF42XX700@nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM> for lsarc-ext@sun.com (ORCPT lsarc-ext@sun.com); Tue, 22 Jul 2008 10:18:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from relay13i.sun.com (ip123.net129179-4.block1.us.syntegra.com [129.179.4.123]) by sca-ea-mail-4.sun.com (8.13.6+Sun/8.12.9) with ESMTP id m6MHIXDV009167 for ; Tue, 22 Jul 2008 17:18:33 +0000 (GMT) Received: from mmp13es.mmp.us.syntegra.com ([160.41.208.13] [160.41.208.13]) by relay13i.sun.com with ESMTP id BT-MMP-162555 for lsarc-ext@sun.com; Tue, 22 Jul 2008 17:18:33 +0000 (Z) Received: from relay17i.sun.com (relay17i.sun.com [129.179.4.127]) by mmp13es.mmp.us.syntegra.com with ESMTP id BT-MMP-231448 for lsarc-ext@sun.com; Tue, 22 Jul 2008 17:18:32 +0000 (Z) Received: from web30802.mail.mud.yahoo.com ([68.142.200.145] [68.142.200.145]) by relay1i.sun.com id BT-MMP-2434119 for lsarc-ext@sun.com; Tue, 22 Jul 2008 17:18:32 +0000 (Z) Received: (qmail 84695 invoked by uid 60001); Tue, 22 Jul 2008 17:18:27 +0000 Received: from [71.52.80.224] by web30802.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 22 Jul 2008 10:18:26 -0700 (PDT) Date: Tue, 22 Jul 2008 10:18:26 -0700 (PDT) From: Octave Orgeron Subject: Re: avant-window-navigator for OpenSolaris [LSARC/2008/452 FastTrack timeout 07/22/2008] To: Brian Cameron , Shi-Ying Irene Huang Cc: Hua.Zhang@sun.com, lsarc-ext@sun.com Message-id: <54286.84228.qm@web30802.mail.mud.yahoo.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: YahooMailRC/1042.40 YahooMailWebService/0.7.218 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Received:X-Mailer:Date:From:Subject:To:Cc:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Message-ID; b=qg0JaJiM/I9nVje6G39q0OaH4O5UH5SOuHXXYBowOvQZMmhJMaJjH+NpiKeR99t9xC78tonm6aKuF0+adbUQgBfu5b7PeZj6KeEAhdzBKGZG6ZS92VxyKwuCE3hU36eyg+F5VtbWKg2qJmgeDOewEJmvQX/4FAfbopQ/InM9g+Q=; X-PMX-Version: 5.4.1.325704 X-Brightmail-Tracker: AAAAAA== X-Antispam: No, score=0.0/5.0, scanned in 0.175sec at (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by smf-spamd v1.3.1 - http://smfs.sf.net/ Status: RO Content-Length: 5922 When will compiz work on SPARC? Have yet to see true parity between x86 and SPARC on features like this. There are many folks out there with SPARC gear and fancy graphics cards. *-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-* Octave J. Orgeron Solaris Systems Engineer http://www.opensolaris.org/os/community/sysadmin/ http://unixconsole.blogspot.com unixconsole@yahoo.com *-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-* ----- Original Message ---- From: Brian Cameron To: Shi-Ying Irene Huang Cc: Hua.Zhang@sun.com; lsarc-ext@sun.com Sent: Tuesday, July 22, 2008 11:19:00 AM Subject: Re: avant-window-navigator for OpenSolaris [LSARC/2008/452 FastTrack timeout 07/22/2008] What is the accessibility impact of this new mechanism of accessing "applet like things"? Does this "just work" with accessibility? If not, what is our plan to make it accessible? Also, how does this relate to gDesklets? Although giving users choice to customize their desktop is a good thing, I hope we aren't going to end up with a mish-mash of random eyecandy that doesn't work well or integrate together. > 2.1. Project Description: > > Avant Window Navigator (AWN/Awn) is a dock-like navigation bar for the > desktop. > > > 2.2. Risks and Assumptions: > > 1. Through the preferences of AWN, AWN manager, user can add new applets, which > is developed by third-party or someone, but they are not stable or missing > some dependencies required to run , so may cause some error. So if > user like to add new applets, should go to Applet Gallery, and install the > stable ones. Do users need to compile code to install a new applet, or are the applets interpreted (e.g. Python code) so that users can just install an applet and it will just work without needing to do extra complicated things like compile code? > If someone develop the applet for AWN, should follow Applet > Submission at http://wiki.awn-project.org/Awn_Extras:Applet_Submission Could you give some examples of what sorts of applets are available for this framework? What applets are installed by default and what do they do? How active are third parties or individuals at creating applets? I notice the Applet Gallery you describe is here: http://wiki.awn-project.org/Applet_Gallery Which ones will we be shipping, if any? > Avant Window Navigator (AWN/Awn) is a dock-like navigation bar for the > linux desktop that positions itself at the bottom of the screen. It can > be used to keep track of open windows and behaves like a normal window > list, you can also add a place or location (home folder or a drive for > example) to the dock. So to make you have control of your computer just > from the dock. Although it does look cool, I worry that it will confuse users if we provide another interface that works very similar to gnome-panel. I would appreciate more information about what our future plans are. Will avant-window-navigator replace gnome-panel, will it be used together with gnome-panel, or is it expected that users will pick one or the other to use? Perhaps you could explain a bit how you expect users would actually use this in relation to gnome-panel. If they are intended to be used together, then is it likely that users be confused by having two sets of interfaces that do very similar things? If the intention is that users would use one or the other, then how do users pick which one to use? In GNOME we already support two window managers (metacity and compiz). Users can easily manage switching between the two because the GNOME configuration dialogs allows users to pick which one they will use. This way users are prevented from possibly trying to run both at the same time, making a more sane user experience. Is switching back and forth between gnome-panel and avant-window-navigator managed in a similar simple fashion? > AWN is a dock-like bar which sits at the bottom of you screen, allowing > you to launch and control applications. Also has the ability to embed > external applets. Look and feel are fully customisable, and theming > support is also available. > > AWN ships with only the Launcher/Taskmanager applet. Many other applets, > such as the Main Menu, "Stacks", CPU meter, and GMail notifier applets > can be found in Awn Extras. Once you have installed some applets, you > can add them to the dock via awn-manager, in the "Applets" section. > > User also can develop plugin for AWN, which allow already-existing > applications to interact with AWN. Awn Extras is a project focusing on > providing a number of important applets (not unlike the panel applets for > Gnome and Xfce) in a single package, along with a number of plugins that > allow applications to better interface with Awn's task manager. > These applets range from a Trash applet to fancy workspace switcher. > To obtain them, follow the Awn Extras download instructions. You will > find the plugins in /awn-extras/awn-plugins. Will we be integrating any of these Extra plugins with this case, or a separate case? Or are you just informing us that end users can install additional applets if they wish? If we aren't shipping any plugins with this case, how useful is avant-window-navigator? In other words, do users need to install any extra plugins for it to be really usable? > The applets included into the core distribution of AWN > > 4.4. Out of Scope: > > Applets developed by third party developers. It is not clear to me if this refers to the "Extra plugins" or not. Brian _______________________________________________ opensolaris-arc mailing list opensolaris-arc@opensolaris.org From Hua.Zhang@sun.com Thu Jul 24 07:25:31 2008 Received: from sunmail2sca.sfbay.sun.com (sunmail2sca.SFBay.Sun.COM [129.145.155.234]) by sac.sfbay.sun.com (8.13.8+Sun/8.13.8) with ESMTP id m6OEPVFS006163 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 2008 07:25:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from brm-avmta-1.central.sun.com (brm-avmta-1.Central.Sun.COM [129.147.4.11]) by sunmail2sca.sfbay.sun.com (8.13.7+Sun/8.13.7/ENSMAIL,v2.2) with ESMTP id m6OEPUcN015763 for <@sunmail2sca.sfbay.sun.com:lsarc-ext@sun.com>; Thu, 24 Jul 2008 07:25:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pmxchannel-daemon.brm-avmta-1.central.sun.com by brm-avmta-1.central.sun.com (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-3.04 (built Jul 15 2005)) id <0K4I009BXLEI9N00@brm-avmta-1.central.sun.com> for lsarc-ext@sun.com (ORCPT lsarc-ext@sun.com); Thu, 24 Jul 2008 08:25:30 -0600 (MDT) Received: from sineb-mail-2.sun.com ([192.18.19.7]) by brm-avmta-1.central.sun.com (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-3.04 (built Jul 15 2005)) with ESMTP id <0K4I0067LLEGHX50@brm-avmta-1.central.sun.com> for lsarc-ext@sun.com (ORCPT lsarc-ext@sun.com); Thu, 24 Jul 2008 08:25:29 -0600 (MDT) Received: from fe-apac-06.sun.com (fe-apac-06.sun.com [192.18.19.177] (may be forged)) by sineb-mail-2.sun.com (8.13.6+Sun/8.12.9) with ESMTP id m6OEQcXg021554 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 2008 14:26:38 +0000 (GMT) Received: from conversion-daemon.mail-apac.sun.com by mail-apac.sun.com (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) id <0K4I00501L3MS300@mail-apac.sun.com> (original mail from Hua.Zhang@Sun.COM) for lsarc-ext@sun.com (ORCPT lsarc-ext@sun.com); Thu, 24 Jul 2008 22:23:00 +0800 (SGT) Received: from [129.158.217.156] by mail-apac.sun.com (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTPSA id <0K4I00BK8LA6RF1W@mail-apac.sun.com>; Thu, 24 Jul 2008 22:23:00 +0800 (SGT) Date: Thu, 24 Jul 2008 22:28:56 +0800 From: Henry Zhang Subject: Re: avant-window-navigator for OpenSolaris [LSARC/2008/452 FastTrack timeout 07/22/2008] In-reply-to: <48860874.7080700@sun.com> Sender: Hua.Zhang@sun.com To: Brian Cameron Cc: Shi-Ying Irene Huang , lsarc-ext@sun.com Message-id: <488891A8.2000100@sun.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=UTF-8 Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT X-PMX-Version: 5.4.1.325704 References: <200807160734.m6G7YjaG013861@sac.sfbay.sun.com> <48860874.7080700@sun.com> User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.6 (X11/20071119) Status: RO Content-Length: 7898 Brian Cameron 写道: > > What is the accessibility impact of this new mechanism of accessing > "applet like things"? Does this "just work" with accessibility? If > not, what is our plan to make it accessible? AWN is used to manage the running task, and some applets. We can use Ctl+Alt+Tab to access the running task, it should be accessibility support. For the applets in AWN, no way to access them through keyboard by now. > > Also, how does this relate to gDesklets? Although giving users choice > to customize their desktop is a good thing, I hope we aren't going to > end up with a mish-mash of random eyecandy that doesn't work well or > integrate together. There is no confliction between gDesklets and AWN, gDesklets used to place the applets to desktop, AWN will run applets in its dock. The applets is different, for gDesklets, using .display file, while AWN need .desktop file in the applet package. > >> 2.1. Project Description: >> Avant Window Navigator (AWN/Awn) is a dock-like >> navigation bar for the >> desktop. >> >> 2.2. Risks and Assumptions: >> 1. Through the preferences of AWN, AWN manager, user can add >> new applets, which is developed by third-party or someone, but >> they are not stable or missing some dependencies required to >> run , so may cause some error. So if user like to add new >> applets, should go to Applet Gallery, and install the >> stable ones. > > Do users need to compile code to install a new applet, or are the > applets interpreted (e.g. Python code) so that users can just install an > applet and it will just work without needing to do extra complicated > things like compile code? Yes, for Python applet, user can use awn-manager to install directly, no compile needed. For C, need to build and install. > >> If someone develop the applet for AWN, should follow Applet >> Submission at http://wiki.awn-project.org/Awn_Extras:Applet_Submission > > Could you give some examples of what sorts of applets are available for > this framework? See http://wiki.awn-project.org/Applets:DevelopmentGuidelines, where list the detailed guideline on what the applet should be. You also can download awn-extras, there are some stable example. >What applets are installed by default and what do they do? Currently from what I can see, there is only 1 applet installed by default, it is Launch/Taskmanager, in order to add some other, have to use awn-extras. >How active are third parties or individuals at creating applets? It really depend on the individual who like to contribute his applet to AWN, from what I can see, there definitely are quite some new applets provided by some developers. > > I notice the Applet Gallery you describe is here: > > http://wiki.awn-project.org/Applet_Gallery > > Which ones will we be shipping, if any? Most of the applets listed in Gallery are just in awn-extra, also there are some applets contributed by some developers, awn-extras is another different project, I tried to build it, failed, because all of applets are in this package, some applet need different dependencies, some of them are missing on Solaris, e.g. python-alsaaudio. > >> Avant Window Navigator (AWN/Awn) is a dock-like navigation bar >> for the linux desktop that positions itself at the bottom of >> the screen. It can be used to keep track of open windows and >> behaves like a normal window list, you can also add a place or >> location (home folder or a drive for >> example) to the dock. So to make you have control of your >> computer just >> from the dock. > > Although it does look cool, I worry that it will confuse users if we > provide another interface that works very similar to gnome-panel. I > would appreciate more information about what our future plans are. Will > avant-window-navigator replace gnome-panel, will it be used together > with gnome-panel, or is it expected that users will pick one or the > other to use? Perhaps you could explain a bit how you expect users > would actually use this in relation to gnome-panel. Yes, It's a big concern now, we have gnome-panel, should we ship AWN? At the moment, AWN can't replace gnome-panel, reason below: 1, AWN need compositing support, it means before run AWN, you have to make Compiz start, then AWN can run, so in the non-Compiz environment, we can only use gnome-panel. 2, There is no launch menu by default in AWN, and the AWN menu can't updates when applications are installed. 3, Trash in AWN is not stable enough now. 4, maybe something others I did not dig out.. > > If they are intended to be used together, then is it likely that users > be confused by having two sets of interfaces that do very similar > things? Yes, this issue also bother me, so I'd say AWN can provide some different experience which gnome-panel can't provide, e.g. 3D.. So if user like to taste, he can download and use it. > > If the intention is that users would use one or the other, then how > do users pick which one to use? By now, we can't remove gnome-panel and use AWN only, the reason listed above, so user need to run both of them. In GNOME we already support two window > managers (metacity and compiz). Users can easily manage switching > between the two because the GNOME configuration dialogs allows users to > pick which one they will use. This way users are prevented from > possibly trying to run both at the same time, making a more sane user > experience. Is switching back and forth between gnome-panel and > avant-window-navigator managed in a similar simple fashion? by now it's impossible to switch between them, because we can't remove gnome-panel. > >> AWN is a dock-like bar which sits at the bottom of you screen, >> allowing you to launch and control applications. Also has the >> ability to embed external applets. Look and feel are fully >> customisable, and theming support is also available. >> >> AWN ships with only the Launcher/Taskmanager applet. Many other >> applets, >> such as the Main Menu, "Stacks", CPU meter, and GMail notifier >> applets can be found in Awn Extras. Once you have installed >> some applets, you can add them to the dock via awn-manager, in >> the "Applets" section. >> >> User also can develop plugin for AWN, which allow >> already-existing applications to interact with AWN. Awn Extras >> is a project focusing on providing a number of important >> applets (not unlike the panel applets for Gnome and Xfce) in a >> single package, along with a number of plugins that allow >> applications to better interface with Awn's task manager. >> These applets range from a Trash applet to fancy workspace >> switcher. To obtain them, follow the Awn Extras download >> instructions. You will find the plugins in >> /awn-extras/awn-plugins. > > Will we be integrating any of these Extra plugins with this case, or a > separate case? Or are you just informing us that end users can install > additional applets if they wish? They should be in awn-extras, it's another project, we may consider to deliver it separately. > > If we aren't shipping any plugins with this case, how useful is > avant-window-navigator? In other words, do users need to install any > extra plugins for it to be really usable? No, they are optional... > >> The applets included into the core distribution of AWN >> >> 4.4. Out of Scope: >> >> Applets developed by third party developers. > > It is not clear to me if this refers to the "Extra plugins" or not. It means the applets developed by some contributor themselves and the ones in awn-extras which is another project and not in core distribution > > Brian From Brian.Cameron@sun.com Fri Jul 25 09:40:17 2008 Received: from sunmail3mpk.sfbay.sun.com (sunmail3mpk.SFBay.Sun.COM [129.146.11.52]) by sac.sfbay.sun.com (8.13.8+Sun/8.13.8) with ESMTP id m6PGeHwZ024832 for ; Fri, 25 Jul 2008 09:40:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nwk-avmta-1.SFBay.Sun.COM (nwk-avmta-1.SFBay.Sun.COM [129.146.11.74]) by sunmail3mpk.sfbay.sun.com (8.13.7+Sun/8.13.7/ENSMAIL,v2.2) with ESMTP id m6PGeG5p001615 for <@sunmail2sca.sfbay.sun.com:lsarc-ext@sun.com>; Fri, 25 Jul 2008 09:40:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pmxchannel-daemon.nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM by nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-3.04 (built Jul 15 2005)) id <0K4K00A09MB30L00@nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM> for lsarc-ext@sun.com (ORCPT lsarc-ext@sun.com); Fri, 25 Jul 2008 09:40:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from brmea-mail-1.sun.com ([192.18.98.31]) by nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-3.04 (built Jul 15 2005)) with ESMTP id <0K4K00A0VMB3L7D0@nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM> for lsarc-ext@sun.com (ORCPT lsarc-ext@sun.com); Fri, 25 Jul 2008 09:40:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from fe-amer-09.sun.com ([192.18.109.79]) by brmea-mail-1.sun.com (8.13.6+Sun/8.12.9) with ESMTP id m6PGeEd2001286 for ; Fri, 25 Jul 2008 16:40:14 +0000 (GMT) Received: from conversion-daemon.mail-amer.sun.com by mail-amer.sun.com (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-8.04 (built Feb 28 2007)) id <0K4K00701L67M100@mail-amer.sun.com> (original mail from Brian.Cameron@Sun.COM) for lsarc-ext@sun.com (ORCPT lsarc-ext@sun.com); Fri, 25 Jul 2008 10:40:14 -0600 (MDT) Received: from [129.156.226.192] by mail-amer.sun.com (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-8.04 (built Feb 28 2007)) with ESMTPSA id <0K4K0093RMAY72G0@mail-amer.sun.com>; Fri, 25 Jul 2008 10:40:11 -0600 (MDT) Date: Fri, 25 Jul 2008 11:40:17 -0500 From: Brian Cameron Subject: Re: avant-window-navigator for OpenSolaris [LSARC/2008/452 FastTrack timeout 07/22/2008] In-reply-to: <488891A8.2000100@sun.com> Sender: Brian.Cameron@sun.com To: Henry Zhang Cc: Shi-Ying Irene Huang , lsarc-ext@sun.com Message-id: <488A01F1.6020209@sun.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=UTF-8 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-PMX-Version: 5.4.1.325704 References: <200807160734.m6G7YjaG013861@sac.sfbay.sun.com> <48860874.7080700@sun.com> <488891A8.2000100@sun.com> User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.14 (X11/20080701) Status: RO Content-Length: 6777 Henry: >> What is the accessibility impact of this new mechanism of accessing >> "applet like things"? Does this "just work" with accessibility? If >> not, what is our plan to make it accessible? > > AWN is used to manage the running task, and some applets. We can use > Ctl+Alt+Tab to access the running task, it should be accessibility support. > For the applets in AWN, no way to access them through keyboard by now. I think it would be good to discuss some sort of get-well plan for a11y in the materials. >> Also, how does this relate to gDesklets? Although giving users choice >> to customize their desktop is a good thing, I hope we aren't going to >> end up with a mish-mash of random eyecandy that doesn't work well or >> integrate together. > > There is no confliction between gDesklets and AWN, gDesklets used to > place the applets to desktop, AWN will run applets in its dock. The > applets is different, for gDesklets, using .display file, while AWN need > .desktop file in the applet package. Might be good to explain the relationship between gnome-panel, gDesklets, and avant-window-navigator in the materials a bit more. >> Do users need to compile code to install a new applet, or are the >> applets interpreted (e.g. Python code) so that users can just install an >> applet and it will just work without needing to do extra complicated >> things like compile code? > > Yes, for Python applet, user can use awn-manager to install directly, no > compile needed. For C, need to build and install. That's good to hear. You could also explain this in the materials a bit more. >>> If someone develop the applet for AWN, should follow Applet >>> Submission at http://wiki.awn-project.org/Awn_Extras:Applet_Submission >> >> Could you give some examples of what sorts of applets are available for >> this framework? > > See http://wiki.awn-project.org/Applets:DevelopmentGuidelines, where > list the detailed guideline on what the applet should be. > You also can download awn-extras, there are some stable example. It doesn't seem like we have spent enough effort figuring out which plugins we should/could be including by default. Wouldn't avant-window-navigator be more useful if we shipped some plugin features with it? Do other distros ship any plugins with it? Perhaps we should follow the general community lead here. Though this could also be managed in a separate case, rather than this case. >> What applets are installed by default and what do they do? > > Currently from what I can see, there is only 1 applet installed by > default, it is Launch/Taskmanager, in order to add some other, have to > use awn-extras. It would be nice if the case materials explained more about the one applet that is installed by default, and what it does, in more detail. >> How active are third parties or individuals at creating applets? > It really depend on the individual who like to contribute his applet to > AWN, from what I can see, there definitely are quite some new applets > provided by some developers. There sure are. I'm curious what applets other distributions might be including by default. >> I notice the Applet Gallery you describe is here: >> >> http://wiki.awn-project.org/Applet_Gallery >> >> Which ones will we be shipping, if any? > Most of the applets listed in Gallery are just in awn-extra, also there > are some applets contributed by some developers, awn-extras is another > different project, I tried to build it, failed, because all of applets > are in this package, some applet need different dependencies, some of > them are missing on Solaris, e.g. python-alsaaudio. On Solaris, we support SunAudio and will hopefully soon support OSS. So any applets which depend on ALSA would obviously not work. It would be nice if we provided (at the very least) a spec-file in spec-files-extra to allow people to more easily build whatever extra plugins do work on Solaris. >> Although it does look cool, I worry that it will confuse users if we >> provide another interface that works very similar to gnome-panel. I >> would appreciate more information about what our future plans are. Will >> avant-window-navigator replace gnome-panel, will it be used together >> with gnome-panel, or is it expected that users will pick one or the >> other to use? Perhaps you could explain a bit how you expect users >> would actually use this in relation to gnome-panel. > > Yes, It's a big concern now, we have gnome-panel, should we ship AWN? > At the moment, AWN can't replace gnome-panel, reason below: > 1, AWN need compositing support, it means before run AWN, you have to > make Compiz start, then AWN can run, so in the non-Compiz environment, > we can only use gnome-panel. > 2, There is no launch menu by default in AWN, and the AWN menu can't > updates when applications are installed. > 3, Trash in AWN is not stable enough now. > 4, maybe something others I did not dig out.. Whether we ship AWN for these reasons is obviously a business decision for the team to make. It shouldn't affect whether the ARC case is approved or not. It might make most sense to integrate it when the above issues are addressed. However, I would make sure you file bugs upstream (probably with both the AWN and gnome-panel projects) to see if we can encourage the upstream maintainers to address some of these issues (along with the a11y issues). I'd talk it over with your project team. >> If they are intended to be used together, then is it likely that users >> be confused by having two sets of interfaces that do very similar >> things? > > Yes, this issue also bother me, so I'd say AWN can provide some > different experience which gnome-panel can't provide, e.g. 3D.. > So if user like to taste, he can download and use it. Right. >> managers (metacity and compiz). Users can easily manage switching >> between the two because the GNOME configuration dialogs allows users to >> pick which one they will use. This way users are prevented from >> possibly trying to run both at the same time, making a more sane user >> experience. Is switching back and forth between gnome-panel and >> avant-window-navigator managed in a similar simple fashion? > > by now it's impossible to switch between them, because we can't remove > gnome-panel. Seems it would be neat to enhance the desktop so users could more easily switch between them if they wanted. >> Will we be integrating any of these Extra plugins with this case, or a >> separate case? Or are you just informing us that end users can install >> additional applets if they wish? > > They should be in awn-extras, it's another project, we may consider to > deliver it separately. Makes sense. Brian From Irene.Huang@sun.com Mon Jul 28 00:53:21 2008 Received: from sunmail5.uk.sun.com (sunmail5.UK.Sun.COM [129.156.85.165]) by sac.sfbay.sun.com (8.13.8+Sun/8.13.8) with ESMTP id m6S7rKRj008041 for ; Mon, 28 Jul 2008 00:53:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nwk-avmta-1.SFBay.Sun.COM (nwk-avmta-1.SFBay.Sun.COM [129.146.11.74]) by sunmail5.uk.sun.com (8.13.8+Sun/8.13.8/ENSMAIL,v2.2) with ESMTP id m6S7r7D9007434 for <@sunmail2sca.sfbay.sun.com:lsarc-ext@sun.com>; Mon, 28 Jul 2008 08:53:20 +0100 (BST) Received: from pmxchannel-daemon.nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM by nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-3.04 (built Jul 15 2005)) id <0K4P00309HWTPA00@nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM> for lsarc-ext@sun.com (ORCPT lsarc-ext@sun.com); Mon, 28 Jul 2008 00:53:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sineb-mail-1.sun.com ([192.18.19.6]) by nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-3.04 (built Jul 15 2005)) with ESMTP id <0K4P00A8LHWS5WA0@nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM> for lsarc-ext@sun.com (ORCPT lsarc-ext@sun.com); Mon, 28 Jul 2008 00:53:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from fe-apac-05.sun.com (fe-apac-05.sun.com [192.18.19.176] (may be forged)) by sineb-mail-1.sun.com (8.13.6+Sun/8.12.9) with ESMTP id m6S7rlDU015362 for ; Mon, 28 Jul 2008 07:53:47 +0000 (GMT) Received: from conversion-daemon.mail-apac.sun.com by mail-apac.sun.com (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) id <0K4P00M01HVHMB00@mail-apac.sun.com> (original mail from Irene.Huang@Sun.COM) for lsarc-ext@sun.com (ORCPT lsarc-ext@sun.com); Mon, 28 Jul 2008 15:52:42 +0800 (SGT) Received: from [129.158.217.138] by mail-apac.sun.com (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTPSA id <0K4P00MI7HVSLRIC@mail-apac.sun.com>; Mon, 28 Jul 2008 15:52:41 +0800 (SGT) Date: Mon, 28 Jul 2008 15:54:14 +0800 From: Irene Huang Subject: Re: avant-window-navigator for OpenSolaris [LSARC/2008/452 FastTrack timeout 07/22/2008] In-reply-to: <488A01F1.6020209@sun.com> Sender: Irene.Huang@sun.com To: Brian Cameron Cc: Henry Zhang , Shi-Ying Irene Huang , lsarc-ext@sun.com Message-id: <1217231654.1774.10.camel@goalie> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Evolution 2.12.2 Content-type: text/plain Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-PMX-Version: 5.4.1.325704 References: <200807160734.m6G7YjaG013861@sac.sfbay.sun.com> <48860874.7080700@sun.com> <488891A8.2000100@sun.com> <488A01F1.6020209@sun.com> Status: RO Content-Length: 7545 Brian On Fri, 2008-07-25 at 11:40 -0500, Brian Cameron wrote: > Henry: > > >> What is the accessibility impact of this new mechanism of accessing > >> "applet like things"? Does this "just work" with accessibility? If > >> not, what is our plan to make it accessible? > > > > AWN is used to manage the running task, and some applets. We can use > > Ctl+Alt+Tab to access the running task, it should be accessibility support. > > For the applets in AWN, no way to access them through keyboard by now. > > I think it would be good to discuss some sort of get-well plan for a11y > in the materials. This is what we have A11Y assessment for. In the assessment form, if A11Y is required, then the project team will draft a get-well plan which is satisfying for APO. > > >> Also, how does this relate to gDesklets? Although giving users choice > >> to customize their desktop is a good thing, I hope we aren't going to > >> end up with a mish-mash of random eyecandy that doesn't work well or > >> integrate together. > > > > There is no confliction between gDesklets and AWN, gDesklets used to > > place the applets to desktop, AWN will run applets in its dock. The > > applets is different, for gDesklets, using .display file, while AWN need > > .desktop file in the applet package. > > Might be good to explain the relationship between gnome-panel, > gDesklets, and avant-window-navigator in the materials a bit more. This (as well as some of the following comments) results in case status changing to "waiting need spec" Henry, please update the proposal and give more explanation as expected. > > >> Do users need to compile code to install a new applet, or are the > >> applets interpreted (e.g. Python code) so that users can just install an > >> applet and it will just work without needing to do extra complicated > >> things like compile code? > > > > Yes, for Python applet, user can use awn-manager to install directly, no > > compile needed. For C, need to build and install. > > That's good to hear. You could also explain this in the materials a bit > more. > > >>> If someone develop the applet for AWN, should follow Applet > >>> Submission at http://wiki.awn-project.org/Awn_Extras:Applet_Submission > >> > >> Could you give some examples of what sorts of applets are available for > >> this framework? > > > > See http://wiki.awn-project.org/Applets:DevelopmentGuidelines, where > > list the detailed guideline on what the applet should be. > > You also can download awn-extras, there are some stable example. > > It doesn't seem like we have spent enough effort figuring out which > plugins we should/could be including by default. Wouldn't > avant-window-navigator be more useful if we shipped some plugin > features with it? Do other distros ship any plugins with it? > Perhaps we should follow the general community lead here. Though > this could also be managed in a separate case, rather than this > case. > > >> What applets are installed by default and what do they do? > > > > Currently from what I can see, there is only 1 applet installed by > > default, it is Launch/Taskmanager, in order to add some other, have to > > use awn-extras. > > It would be nice if the case materials explained more about the one > applet that is installed by default, and what it does, in more detail. > > >> How active are third parties or individuals at creating applets? > > It really depend on the individual who like to contribute his applet to > > AWN, from what I can see, there definitely are quite some new applets > > provided by some developers. > > There sure are. I'm curious what applets other distributions might be > including by default. > > >> I notice the Applet Gallery you describe is here: > >> > >> http://wiki.awn-project.org/Applet_Gallery > >> > >> Which ones will we be shipping, if any? > > Most of the applets listed in Gallery are just in awn-extra, also there > > are some applets contributed by some developers, awn-extras is another > > different project, I tried to build it, failed, because all of applets > > are in this package, some applet need different dependencies, some of > > them are missing on Solaris, e.g. python-alsaaudio. > > On Solaris, we support SunAudio and will hopefully soon support OSS. So > any applets which depend on ALSA would obviously not work. It would be > nice if we provided (at the very least) a spec-file in spec-files-extra > to allow people to more easily build whatever extra plugins do work on > Solaris. Henry, this requires your action :) Thanks --Irene > > >> Although it does look cool, I worry that it will confuse users if we > >> provide another interface that works very similar to gnome-panel. I > >> would appreciate more information about what our future plans are. Will > >> avant-window-navigator replace gnome-panel, will it be used together > >> with gnome-panel, or is it expected that users will pick one or the > >> other to use? Perhaps you could explain a bit how you expect users > >> would actually use this in relation to gnome-panel. > > > > Yes, It's a big concern now, we have gnome-panel, should we ship AWN? > > At the moment, AWN can't replace gnome-panel, reason below: > > 1, AWN need compositing support, it means before run AWN, you have to > > make Compiz start, then AWN can run, so in the non-Compiz environment, > > we can only use gnome-panel. > > 2, There is no launch menu by default in AWN, and the AWN menu can't > > updates when applications are installed. > > 3, Trash in AWN is not stable enough now. > > 4, maybe something others I did not dig out.. > > Whether we ship AWN for these reasons is obviously a business decision > for the team to make. It shouldn't affect whether the ARC case is > approved or not. It might make most sense to integrate it when the > above issues are addressed. However, I would make sure you file bugs > upstream (probably with both the AWN and gnome-panel projects) to see > if we can encourage the upstream maintainers to address some of these > issues (along with the a11y issues). > > I'd talk it over with your project team. > > >> If they are intended to be used together, then is it likely that users > >> be confused by having two sets of interfaces that do very similar > >> things? > > > > Yes, this issue also bother me, so I'd say AWN can provide some > > different experience which gnome-panel can't provide, e.g. 3D.. > > So if user like to taste, he can download and use it. > > Right. > > >> managers (metacity and compiz). Users can easily manage switching > >> between the two because the GNOME configuration dialogs allows users to > >> pick which one they will use. This way users are prevented from > >> possibly trying to run both at the same time, making a more sane user > >> experience. Is switching back and forth between gnome-panel and > >> avant-window-navigator managed in a similar simple fashion? > > > > by now it's impossible to switch between them, because we can't remove > > gnome-panel. > > Seems it would be neat to enhance the desktop so users could more easily > switch between them if they wanted. > > >> Will we be integrating any of these Extra plugins with this case, or a > >> separate case? Or are you just informing us that end users can install > >> additional applets if they wish? > > > > They should be in awn-extras, it's another project, we may consider to > > deliver it separately. > > Makes sense. > > Brian From Hua.Zhang@sun.com Tue Jul 29 03:54:44 2008 Received: from sunmail4.singapore.sun.com (sunmail4.Singapore.Sun.COM [129.158.71.19]) by sac.sfbay.sun.com (8.13.8+Sun/8.13.8) with ESMTP id m6TAsher026749 for ; Tue, 29 Jul 2008 03:54:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nwk-avmta-2.sfbay.sun.com (nwk-avmta-2.SFBay.Sun.COM [129.145.155.6]) by sunmail4.singapore.sun.com (8.13.4+Sun/8.13.3/ENSMAIL,v2.2) with ESMTP id m6TAsfrF025840 for <@sunmail2sca.sfbay.sun.com:lsarc-ext@sun.com>; Tue, 29 Jul 2008 18:54:42 +0800 (SGT) Received: from pmxchannel-daemon.nwk-avmta-2.sfbay.sun.com by nwk-avmta-2.sfbay.sun.com (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-3.04 (built Jul 15 2005)) id <0K4R00M07KZ4AJ00@nwk-avmta-2.sfbay.sun.com> for lsarc-ext@sun.com (ORCPT lsarc-ext@sun.com); Tue, 29 Jul 2008 03:54:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sineb-mail-1.sun.com ([192.18.19.6]) by nwk-avmta-2.sfbay.sun.com (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-3.04 (built Jul 15 2005)) with ESMTP id <0K4R00I6WKZ39S30@nwk-avmta-2.sfbay.sun.com> for lsarc-ext@sun.com (ORCPT lsarc-ext@sun.com); Tue, 29 Jul 2008 03:54:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from fe-apac-06.sun.com (fe-apac-06.sun.com [192.18.19.177] (may be forged)) by sineb-mail-1.sun.com (8.13.6+Sun/8.12.9) with ESMTP id m6TAscXv029659 for ; Tue, 29 Jul 2008 10:54:38 +0000 (GMT) Received: from conversion-daemon.mail-apac.sun.com by mail-apac.sun.com (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) id <0K4R00801KYBLM00@mail-apac.sun.com> (original mail from Hua.Zhang@Sun.COM) for lsarc-ext@sun.com (ORCPT lsarc-ext@sun.com); Tue, 29 Jul 2008 18:54:38 +0800 (SGT) Received: from [129.158.217.156] by mail-apac.sun.com (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTPSA id <0K4R009AIKZ18GBK@mail-apac.sun.com>; Tue, 29 Jul 2008 18:54:38 +0800 (SGT) Date: Tue, 29 Jul 2008 18:58:22 +0800 From: Henry Zhang Subject: Re: avant-window-navigator for OpenSolaris [LSARC/2008/452 FastTrack timeout 07/22/2008] In-reply-to: <488A01F1.6020209@sun.com> Sender: Hua.Zhang@sun.com To: Brian Cameron Cc: Shi-Ying Irene Huang , lsarc-ext@sun.com Message-id: <488EF7CE.3080401@sun.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/mixed; boundary="Boundary_(ID_V/TMlZLW1ofyuZ3chsgQNw)" X-PMX-Version: 5.4.1.325704 References: <200807160734.m6G7YjaG013861@sac.sfbay.sun.com> <48860874.7080700@sun.com> <488891A8.2000100@sun.com> <488A01F1.6020209@sun.com> User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.6 (X11/20071119) Status: RO Content-Length: 19399 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --Boundary_(ID_V/TMlZLW1ofyuZ3chsgQNw) Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=UTF-8 Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT Hi Brain, See my answer in-line, And I finished the proposal to add some change from the discussing, see attachement. Thanks, Henry Brian Cameron 写道: > > Henry: > >>> What is the accessibility impact of this new mechanism of accessing >>> "applet like things"? Does this "just work" with accessibility? If >>> not, what is our plan to make it accessible? >> >> AWN is used to manage the running task, and some applets. We can use >> Ctl+Alt+Tab to access the running task, it should be accessibility >> support. >> For the applets in AWN, no way to access them through keyboard by now. > > I think it would be good to discuss some sort of get-well plan for a11y > in the materials. These days I discussed accessibility support with the community, they confirm me that they have not consider this issue, I will try to push them to see if they can do some work on it, at least I can see they begin to think add some support so that user can access AWN by keyboard. And by now we can use Ctl+Alt+Tab to switch in the running applications, so these should be support accessibility. > >>> Also, how does this relate to gDesklets? Although giving users choice >>> to customize their desktop is a good thing, I hope we aren't going to >>> end up with a mish-mash of random eyecandy that doesn't work well or >>> integrate together. >> >> There is no confliction between gDesklets and AWN, gDesklets used to >> place the applets to desktop, AWN will run applets in its dock. The >> applets is different, for gDesklets, using .display file, while AWN >> need .desktop file in the applet package. > > Might be good to explain the relationship between gnome-panel, > gDesklets, and avant-window-navigator in the materials a bit more. Added soome explanation on Details of the proposal. > >>> Do users need to compile code to install a new applet, or are the >>> applets interpreted (e.g. Python code) so that users can just install an >>> applet and it will just work without needing to do extra complicated >>> things like compile code? >> >> Yes, for Python applet, user can use awn-manager to install directly, >> no compile needed. For C, need to build and install. > > That's good to hear. You could also explain this in the materials a bit > more. Added soome explanation on Details of the proposal. > >>>> If someone develop the applet for AWN, should follow Applet >>>> Submission at http://wiki.awn-project.org/Awn_Extras:Applet_Submission >>> >>> Could you give some examples of what sorts of applets are available for >>> this framework? >> >> See http://wiki.awn-project.org/Applets:DevelopmentGuidelines, where >> list the detailed guideline on what the applet should be. >> You also can download awn-extras, there are some stable example. > > It doesn't seem like we have spent enough effort figuring out which > plugins we should/could be including by default. Wouldn't > avant-window-navigator be more useful if we shipped some plugin > features with it? They generally used to make the display effect better to look, so not necessary. >Do other distros ship any plugins with it? > Perhaps we should follow the general community lead here. Though > this could also be managed in a separate case, rather than this > case. From the webpage, the plugin is with awn-extras, so should in another project. And most of plugins are Ubuntu-special. > >>> What applets are installed by default and what do they do? >> >> Currently from what I can see, there is only 1 applet installed by >> default, it is Launch/Taskmanager, in order to add some other, have to >> use awn-extras. > > It would be nice if the case materials explained more about the one > applet that is installed by default, and what it does, in more detail. Added soome explanation on Details of the proposal. > >>> How active are third parties or individuals at creating applets? >> It really depend on the individual who like to contribute his applet >> to AWN, from what I can see, there definitely are quite some new >> applets provided by some developers. > > There sure are. I'm curious what applets other distributions might be > including by default. In AWN, by default there is only one applet, all other applets need to be added by awn-extras, I discussed with the community yesterday, they told me "There are some plans to include more applets in the core installation." > >>> I notice the Applet Gallery you describe is here: >>> http://wiki.awn-project.org/Applet_Gallery >>> >>> Which ones will we be shipping, if any? >> Most of the applets listed in Gallery are just in awn-extra, also >> there are some applets contributed by some developers, awn-extras is >> another different project, I tried to build it, failed, because all of >> applets are in this package, some applet need different dependencies, >> some of them are missing on Solaris, e.g. python-alsaaudio. > > On Solaris, we support SunAudio and will hopefully soon support OSS. So > any applets which depend on ALSA would obviously not work. It would be > nice if we provided (at the very least) a spec-file in spec-files-extra > to allow people to more easily build whatever extra plugins do work on > Solaris. Will do once got time.. > >>> Although it does look cool, I worry that it will confuse users if we >>> provide another interface that works very similar to gnome-panel. I >>> would appreciate more information about what our future plans are. Will >>> avant-window-navigator replace gnome-panel, will it be used together >>> with gnome-panel, or is it expected that users will pick one or the >>> other to use? Perhaps you could explain a bit how you expect users >>> would actually use this in relation to gnome-panel. >> >> Yes, It's a big concern now, we have gnome-panel, should we ship AWN? >> At the moment, AWN can't replace gnome-panel, reason below: >> 1, AWN need compositing support, it means before run AWN, you have to >> make Compiz start, then AWN can run, so in the non-Compiz environment, >> we can only use gnome-panel. >> 2, There is no launch menu by default in AWN, and the AWN menu can't >> updates when applications are installed. >> 3, Trash in AWN is not stable enough now. >> 4, maybe something others I did not dig out.. > > Whether we ship AWN for these reasons is obviously a business decision > for the team to make. It shouldn't affect whether the ARC case is > approved or not. It might make most sense to integrate it when the > above issues are addressed. However, I would make sure you file bugs > upstream (probably with both the AWN and gnome-panel projects) to see > if we can encourage the upstream maintainers to address some of these > issues (along with the a11y issues). > > I'd talk it over with your project team. Yes, I did discuss with the project team, and I noticed they have realized these issue, and discussing how to fix them, but no schedule now. > >>> If they are intended to be used together, then is it likely that users >>> be confused by having two sets of interfaces that do very similar >>> things? >> >> Yes, this issue also bother me, so I'd say AWN can provide some >> different experience which gnome-panel can't provide, e.g. 3D.. >> So if user like to taste, he can download and use it. > > Right. > >>> managers (metacity and compiz). Users can easily manage switching >>> between the two because the GNOME configuration dialogs allows users to >>> pick which one they will use. This way users are prevented from >>> possibly trying to run both at the same time, making a more sane user >>> experience. Is switching back and forth between gnome-panel and >>> avant-window-navigator managed in a similar simple fashion? >> >> by now it's impossible to switch between them, because we can't remove >> gnome-panel. > > Seems it would be neat to enhance the desktop so users could more easily > switch between them if they wanted. Yes, I agree, so in Ubuntu, they generally close the gnome-panel at the bottom, and only make the top panel run, and AWN run at the bottom of screen, I think we can do in this way, and it's planned that AWN will be placed anywhere of screen, so in the future, we can make these 2 work together better.. > >>> Will we be integrating any of these Extra plugins with this case, or a >>> separate case? Or are you just informing us that end users can install >>> additional applets if they wish? >> >> They should be in awn-extras, it's another project, we may consider to >> deliver it separately. > > Makes sense. > > Brian --Boundary_(ID_V/TMlZLW1ofyuZ3chsgQNw) Content-type: text/plain; name=proposal-one-pager-awn.txt Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline; filename=proposal-one-pager-awn.txt Template Version: @(#)onepager.txt 1.29 04/11/15 SMI 1. Introduction 1.1. Project/Component Working Name: Avant-window-navigator 1.2. Name of Document Author/Supplier: Henry Zhang (hua.zhang@sun.com) 1.3. Date of This Document: 10/07/08 1.4. Name of Major Document Customer(s)/Consumer(s): 1.4.1. The PAC or CPT you expect to review your project: Solaris PAC 1.4.2. The ARC(s) you expect to review your project: LSARC 1.4.3. The Director/VP who is "Sponsoring" this project: Robert.Odea@Sun.Com 1.4.4. The name of your business unit: JDS Desktop Engineering, OPG 1.5. Email Aliases: 1.5.1. Responsible Manager: leo.binchy@Sun.COM 1.5.2. Responsible Engineer: hua.zhang@Sun.COM 1.5.3. Marketing Manager: jeff.mcmeekin@sun.com 1.5.4. Interest List: awn@sun.com 2. Project Summary 2.1. Project Description: Avant Window Navigator (AWN/Awn) is a dock-like navigation bar for the desktop. 2.2. Risks and Assumptions: 1. Through the preferences of AWN, AWN manager, user can add new applets, which is developed by third-party or someone, but they are not stable or missing some dependencies required to run , so may cause some error. So if user like to add new applets, should go to Applet Gallery, and install the stable ones. If someone develop the applet for AWN, should follow Applet Submission at http://wiki.awn-project.org/Awn_Extras:Applet_Submission 2. AWN don't support accessibility at the moment, the community didn't consider this before, so need to take some push so to make it support accessibility. Now user can use Ctl+Alt+Tab to switch in the running applications, this can support accessibility. 3. Business Summary 3.1. Problem Area: Now all of the Operating System is providing the desktop tool for user to view and control system, user can start many applications in the system, so it's useful to provide user a GUI tool to list all of the running applications, and user can use it to active/deactive the application or access some location by simply click one icon. Avant Window Navigator (Awn) is just this type of tool, it looks very cool, and really provide user great convenience to manage the running applications. 3.2. Market/Requester: JDS Desktop group 3.3. Business Justification: Avant Window Navigator (Awn) is a dock-like bar which sits at the bottom of the screen. It has support for launchers, task lists, and third party applets. So it can provide user an easy way to track the opened windows, and user can launch some location by simply click some launcher, user also can add applets, and set the theme to make AWN looks very cool. 3.4. Competitive Analysis: Mac OS has leopard Dock. 3.5. Opportunity Window/Exposure: It is expected that this project will be integrated into Nevada B99. 3.6. How will you know when you are done?: When it is ported to Nevada and runs correctly. The project will be complete when there are no stoppers, P1 or P2 bugs. 4. Technical Description: 4.1. Details: Avant Window Navigator (AWN/Awn) is a dock-like navigation bar for the linux desktop that positions itself at the bottom of the screen. It can be used to keep track of open windows and behaves like a normal window list, you can also add a place or location (home folder or a drive for example) to the dock. So to make you have control of your computer just from the dock. AWN is a dock-like bar which sits at the bottom of you screen, allowing you to launch and control applications. Also has the ability to embed external applets. Look and feel are fully customisable, and theming support is also available. AWN ships with only the Launcher/Taskmanager applet by default, which is used to manage the launcher and task running. Many other applets, such as the Main Menu, "Stacks", CPU meter, and GMail notifier applets can be found in Awn Extras. Once you have installed some applets, you can add them to the dock via awn-manager, in the "Applets" section. User also can develop plugin for AWN, which allow already-existing applications to interact with AWN. Awn Extras is a project focusing on providing a number of important applets (not unlike the panel applets for Gnome and Xfce) in a single package, along with a number of plugins that allow applications to better interface with Awn's task manager. These applets range from a Trash applet to fancy workspace switcher. To obtain them, follow the Awn Extras download instructions. You will find plugins in /awn-extras/awn-plugins. If you like to develop the applet by yourself, it's easy enough, if the applet is written in Python, you can install it directly, not need compile, but if it's in C, Makefile will need to be provided to handle the installation details properly, then you can compile and install. Now on Solaris we have gnome-panel run by default, and AWN is also the Similar tool. But by now AWN can't replace gnome-panel, they should exist together for a while, the reason is: * 1, AWN need compositing support, it means before run AWN, you have to make Compiz start, then AWN can run, so in the non-Compiz environment, we can only use gnome-panel. * 2, There is no launch menu by default in AWN, and the AWN menu can't updates when applications are installed. * 3, Trash in AWN is not stable enough now. We have gDesklet on Solaris, it can used to add applets to Desktop, While AWN is adding and running the applet in the dock, in fact the applet requirement in these two application is not totally same, gDesklet need .display file, and AWN need .desktop file. 4.2. Bug/RFE Number(s): N/A 4.3. In Scope: The applets included into the core distribution of AWN 4.4. Out of Scope: Applets developed by third party developers and the ones in awn-extras. 4.5. Interfaces: Imported Interfaces Interface Stability Comments ------------------- ----------- ----------------------------------- X11 libraries & protocols Standard ASARC 1995/265, PSARC 1998/299 libXrender.so.1 External dbus Volatile LSARC/2006/368 libXdamage External LSARC/2003/506 libXcomposite Volatile PSARC/2007/240 gnome-python2-gconf Uncommitted LSARC/2005/506 gnome-python-desktop Volatile LSARC/2006/202 Python Volatile PSARC/2005/532, PSARC/2006/290 PSARC/2006/290 GNOME Committed Platform Libraries Committed LSARC/2007/520 GTK+ library GNOME 2.20 Exported Interfaces Stability Comments ------------------------- ------------- --------------------------------- /usr/bin/awn-applet-activation Volatile /usr/bin/avant-window-navigator Volatile /usr/bin/awn-launcher-editor Volatile /usr/bin/awn-manager Volatile /usr/bin/awn-schema-to-gconf Volatile SUNWavant Uncommitted Package name SUNWavant-devel Uncommitted Package name SUNWavant-root Uncommitted Package name 4.6. Doc Impact: Man page will need to be added 4.7. Admin/Config Impact: There are no changes to the system administration and configuration. 4.8. HA Impact: N/A 4.9. I18N/L10N Impact: To be needed 4.10. Packaging & Delivery: The new packages are: - SUNWavant - SUNWavant-devel - SUNWavant-root 4.11. Security Impact: There is no additional security impact for Solaris. 4.12. Dependencies: libwnck-1.0 gnome-desktop-2.0 libgnome-2.0 gnome-vfs-2.0 gconf-2.0 x11 xproto dbus-glib-1 libglade-2.0 xdamage xcomposite xrender python2.5-dev python-gnome2-dev python-gnome2-desktop-dev python-gnome2-extras-dev 5. Reference Documents: Avant Window Navigator main project page: http://launchpad.net/awn Avant Window Navigator Wiki: http://wiki.awn-project.org/ Avant Window Navigator Forum: http://www.planetblur.org/hosted/awnforum 6. Resources and Schedule: 6.1. Projected Availability: Expect to integrated into Nevada in build 99 in Q3 2008 6.2. Cost of Effort: Development 1.0 Engineers - 1 Months Testing 0.5 Engineers - 1 Week RE 0.5 Engineers - 1 Week 6.3. Cost of Capital Resources: N/A 6.4. Product Approval Committee requested information: 6.4.1. Consolidation or Component Name: JDS / OpenSolaris 6.4.3. Type of CPT Review and Approval expected: Standard 6.4.4. Project Boundary Conditions: None 6.4.5. Is this a necessary project for OEM agreements: No 6.4.6. Notes: N/A 6.4.7. Target RTI Date/Release: Nevada B99 - August 2008 6.4.8. Target Code Design Review Date: August 2008 6.4.9. Update approval addition: New project, no Solaris PAC approval yet 6.5. ARC review type: FastTrack 7. Prototype Availability: 7.1. Prototype Availability: August 2008 7.2. Prototype Cost: 1 engineer 1 QA 1 RE --Boundary_(ID_V/TMlZLW1ofyuZ3chsgQNw)-- From Hua.Zhang@sun.com Tue Jul 29 19:11:15 2008 Received: from sunmail5.uk.sun.com (sunmail5.UK.Sun.COM [129.156.85.165]) by sac.sfbay.sun.com (8.13.8+Sun/8.13.8) with ESMTP id m6U2BEkl020849 for ; Tue, 29 Jul 2008 19:11:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: from brm-avmta-1.central.sun.com (brm-avmta-1.Central.Sun.COM [129.147.4.11]) by sunmail5.uk.sun.com (8.13.8+Sun/8.13.8/ENSMAIL,v2.2) with ESMTP id m6U2BA34003918 for <@sunmail2sca.sfbay.sun.com:lsarc-ext@sun.com>; Wed, 30 Jul 2008 03:11:13 +0100 (BST) Received: from pmxchannel-daemon.brm-avmta-1.central.sun.com by brm-avmta-1.central.sun.com (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-3.04 (built Jul 15 2005)) id <0K4S0070PREKXN00@brm-avmta-1.central.sun.com> for lsarc-ext@sun.com (ORCPT lsarc-ext@sun.com); Tue, 29 Jul 2008 20:11:08 -0600 (MDT) Received: from sineb-mail-2.sun.com ([192.18.19.7]) by brm-avmta-1.central.sun.com (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-3.04 (built Jul 15 2005)) with ESMTP id <0K4S006NOREJQHD0@brm-avmta-1.central.sun.com> for lsarc-ext@sun.com (ORCPT lsarc-ext@sun.com); Tue, 29 Jul 2008 20:11:08 -0600 (MDT) Received: from fe-apac-05.sun.com (fe-apac-05.sun.com [192.18.19.176] (may be forged)) by sineb-mail-2.sun.com (8.13.6+Sun/8.12.9) with ESMTP id m6U2B7l8013692 for ; Wed, 30 Jul 2008 02:11:07 +0000 (GMT) Received: from conversion-daemon.mail-apac.sun.com by mail-apac.sun.com (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) id <0K4S00601RCEVK00@mail-apac.sun.com> (original mail from Hua.Zhang@Sun.COM) for lsarc-ext@sun.com (ORCPT lsarc-ext@sun.com); Wed, 30 Jul 2008 10:11:06 +0800 (SGT) Received: from [129.158.217.156] by mail-apac.sun.com (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTPSA id <0K4S00MOZREH9VYD@mail-apac.sun.com>; Wed, 30 Jul 2008 10:11:06 +0800 (SGT) Date: Wed, 30 Jul 2008 10:14:50 +0800 From: Henry Zhang Subject: Re: avant-window-navigator for OpenSolaris [LSARC/2008/452 FastTrack timeout 07/22/2008] In-reply-to: <488EF7CE.3080401@sun.com> Sender: Hua.Zhang@sun.com To: Henry Zhang Cc: Brian Cameron , Shi-Ying Irene Huang , lsarc-ext@sun.com Message-id: <488FCE9A.8000208@sun.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/mixed; boundary="Boundary_(ID_MrjedhXkK36h1q+bH51ptQ)" X-PMX-Version: 5.4.1.325704 References: <200807160734.m6G7YjaG013861@sac.sfbay.sun.com> <48860874.7080700@sun.com> <488891A8.2000100@sun.com> <488A01F1.6020209@sun.com> <488EF7CE.3080401@sun.com> User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.6 (X11/20071119) Status: RO Content-Length: 11097 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --Boundary_(ID_MrjedhXkK36h1q+bH51ptQ) Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=UTF-8 Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT Hi all, I made some changes on the proposal to make it neat, please check. Thank Brian for review... Regards, Henry Henry Zhang 写道: > Hi Brain, See my answer in-line, > > And I finished the proposal to add some change from the discussing, see > attachement. > > Thanks, > Henry > > Brian Cameron 写道: >> >> Henry: >> >>>> What is the accessibility impact of this new mechanism of accessing >>>> "applet like things"? Does this "just work" with accessibility? If >>>> not, what is our plan to make it accessible? >>> >>> AWN is used to manage the running task, and some applets. We can use >>> Ctl+Alt+Tab to access the running task, it should be accessibility >>> support. >>> For the applets in AWN, no way to access them through keyboard by now. >> >> I think it would be good to discuss some sort of get-well plan for a11y >> in the materials. > > These days I discussed accessibility support with the community, they > confirm me that they have not consider this issue, I will try to push > them to see if they can do some work on it, at least I can see they > begin to think add some support so that user can access AWN by keyboard. > And by now we can use Ctl+Alt+Tab to switch in the running applications, > so these should be support accessibility. >> >>>> Also, how does this relate to gDesklets? Although giving users choice >>>> to customize their desktop is a good thing, I hope we aren't going to >>>> end up with a mish-mash of random eyecandy that doesn't work well or >>>> integrate together. >>> >>> There is no confliction between gDesklets and AWN, gDesklets used to >>> place the applets to desktop, AWN will run applets in its dock. The >>> applets is different, for gDesklets, using .display file, while AWN >>> need .desktop file in the applet package. >> >> Might be good to explain the relationship between gnome-panel, >> gDesklets, and avant-window-navigator in the materials a bit more. > Added soome explanation on Details of the proposal. >> >>>> Do users need to compile code to install a new applet, or are the >>>> applets interpreted (e.g. Python code) so that users can just >>>> install an >>>> applet and it will just work without needing to do extra complicated >>>> things like compile code? >>> >>> Yes, for Python applet, user can use awn-manager to install directly, >>> no compile needed. For C, need to build and install. >> >> That's good to hear. You could also explain this in the materials a bit >> more. > > Added soome explanation on Details of the proposal. >> >>>>> If someone develop the applet for AWN, should follow Applet >>>>> Submission at http://wiki.awn-project.org/Awn_Extras:Applet_Submission >>>> >>>> Could you give some examples of what sorts of applets are available for >>>> this framework? >>> >>> See http://wiki.awn-project.org/Applets:DevelopmentGuidelines, where >>> list the detailed guideline on what the applet should be. >>> You also can download awn-extras, there are some stable example. >> >> It doesn't seem like we have spent enough effort figuring out which >> plugins we should/could be including by default. Wouldn't >> avant-window-navigator be more useful if we shipped some plugin >> features with it? > They generally used to make the display effect better to look, so not > necessary. >> Do other distros ship any plugins with it? >> Perhaps we should follow the general community lead here. Though >> this could also be managed in a separate case, rather than this >> case. > From the webpage, the plugin is with awn-extras, so should in another > project. And most of plugins are Ubuntu-special. >> >>>> What applets are installed by default and what do they do? >>> >>> Currently from what I can see, there is only 1 applet installed by >>> default, it is Launch/Taskmanager, in order to add some other, have >>> to use awn-extras. >> >> It would be nice if the case materials explained more about the one >> applet that is installed by default, and what it does, in more detail. > Added soome explanation on Details of the proposal. > >> >>>> How active are third parties or individuals at creating applets? >>> It really depend on the individual who like to contribute his applet >>> to AWN, from what I can see, there definitely are quite some new >>> applets provided by some developers. >> >> There sure are. I'm curious what applets other distributions might be >> including by default. > In AWN, by default there is only one applet, all other applets need to > be added by awn-extras, I discussed with the community yesterday, they > told me "There are some plans to include more applets in the core > installation." >> >>>> I notice the Applet Gallery you describe is here: >>>> http://wiki.awn-project.org/Applet_Gallery >>>> >>>> Which ones will we be shipping, if any? >>> Most of the applets listed in Gallery are just in awn-extra, also >>> there are some applets contributed by some developers, awn-extras is >>> another different project, I tried to build it, failed, because all >>> of applets are in this package, some applet need different >>> dependencies, some of them are missing on Solaris, e.g. >>> python-alsaaudio. >> >> On Solaris, we support SunAudio and will hopefully soon support OSS. So >> any applets which depend on ALSA would obviously not work. It would be >> nice if we provided (at the very least) a spec-file in spec-files-extra >> to allow people to more easily build whatever extra plugins do work on >> Solaris. > Will do once got time.. >> >>>> Although it does look cool, I worry that it will confuse users if we >>>> provide another interface that works very similar to gnome-panel. I >>>> would appreciate more information about what our future plans are. >>>> Will >>>> avant-window-navigator replace gnome-panel, will it be used together >>>> with gnome-panel, or is it expected that users will pick one or the >>>> other to use? Perhaps you could explain a bit how you expect users >>>> would actually use this in relation to gnome-panel. >>> >>> Yes, It's a big concern now, we have gnome-panel, should we ship AWN? >>> At the moment, AWN can't replace gnome-panel, reason below: >>> 1, AWN need compositing support, it means before run AWN, you have to >>> make Compiz start, then AWN can run, so in the non-Compiz >>> environment, we can only use gnome-panel. >>> 2, There is no launch menu by default in AWN, and the AWN menu can't >>> updates when applications are installed. >>> 3, Trash in AWN is not stable enough now. >>> 4, maybe something others I did not dig out.. >> >> Whether we ship AWN for these reasons is obviously a business decision >> for the team to make. It shouldn't affect whether the ARC case is >> approved or not. It might make most sense to integrate it when the >> above issues are addressed. However, I would make sure you file bugs >> upstream (probably with both the AWN and gnome-panel projects) to see >> if we can encourage the upstream maintainers to address some of these >> issues (along with the a11y issues). >> >> I'd talk it over with your project team. > Yes, I did discuss with the project team, and I noticed they have > realized these issue, and discussing how to fix them, but no schedule now. >> >>>> If they are intended to be used together, then is it likely that users >>>> be confused by having two sets of interfaces that do very similar >>>> things? >>> >>> Yes, this issue also bother me, so I'd say AWN can provide some >>> different experience which gnome-panel can't provide, e.g. 3D.. >>> So if user like to taste, he can download and use it. >> >> Right. >> >>>> managers (metacity and compiz). Users can easily manage switching >>>> between the two because the GNOME configuration dialogs allows users to >>>> pick which one they will use. This way users are prevented from >>>> possibly trying to run both at the same time, making a more sane user >>>> experience. Is switching back and forth between gnome-panel and >>>> avant-window-navigator managed in a similar simple fashion? >>> >>> by now it's impossible to switch between them, because we can't >>> remove gnome-panel. >> >> Seems it would be neat to enhance the desktop so users could more easily >> switch between them if they wanted. > Yes, I agree, so in Ubuntu, they generally close the gnome-panel at the > bottom, and only make the top panel run, and AWN run at the bottom of > screen, I think we can do in this way, and it's planned that AWN will be > placed anywhere of screen, so in the future, we can make these 2 work > together better.. > >> >>>> Will we be integrating any of these Extra plugins with this case, or a >>>> separate case? Or are you just informing us that end users can install >>>> additional applets if they wish? >>> >>> They should be in awn-extras, it's another project, we may consider >>> to deliver it separately. >> >> Makes sense. >> >> Brian --Boundary_(ID_MrjedhXkK36h1q+bH51ptQ) Content-type: text/plain; name=awn-project-plan.txt Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline; filename=awn-project-plan.txt Item Name Owner Start Date Expected Completion comments Project Plan ARC one-pager Done. ARC fast track ongoing Open Source Review done ECCN Not start Porting done spec/SUNWspec file done to spec-files-other/core copyright file done to spec-files-other/copyright G11n done need send a request to Takao.Fujiwara@Sun.COM and cc desktop-discuss@opensolaris.org launch menu, done need to send the .desktop file to calum benson, have a description of your project and why you want to put it to the menu. ARC Material not start dump -Lv/ CLI.txt(--help)/ manpage / schemas/ pkgmap manpage not start test&fix not start ======================= Not necessary ============================================== Cteam Checklist HenryZ Mar. 1 07 Mar. 15 07 Not necessary Contract HenryZ Mar. 20 07 Mar. 30 07 ongoing TPT HenryZ Mar. 19 07 Mar. 21 07 Done. And store at /net/solaris.eng/benet/S11/TPT/JDS/virt-manager "What's New" Form at http://releaseme.sfbay/new_features_input.html Write Test Plan PatrickG Dec. 18 06 Dec. 23 06 Done, UI review Calum Nov. 21 06 Nov. 30 06 Have sent mail to Calum, Pre-integration Test PatrickG Mar. 22 07 Apr. 15 07 Preparing by Patrick Gu A11Y testing TimM Mar. 22 07 Apr. 20 07 Need confirm from TimM L10n HelenW Dec. 25 06 Jan. 01 07 Need confirm from HelenW TOI Doc plan manpages, project plan, TPT, What's New doc(S10U) etc. Pre-integ Bug Fixing HenryZ Apr. 15 07 Apr. 30 07 B65 code freeze date is May 4 07, but there is holiday on May 1~7 --Boundary_(ID_MrjedhXkK36h1q+bH51ptQ)-- From Irene.Huang@sun.com Wed Jul 30 00:46:59 2008 Received: from sunmail4.singapore.sun.com (sunmail4.Singapore.Sun.COM [129.158.71.19]) by sac.sfbay.sun.com (8.13.8+Sun/8.13.8) with ESMTP id m6U7kwLD028284 for ; Wed, 30 Jul 2008 00:46:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nwk-avmta-1.SFBay.Sun.COM (nwk-avmta-1.SFBay.Sun.COM [129.146.11.74]) by sunmail4.singapore.sun.com (8.13.4+Sun/8.13.3/ENSMAIL,v2.2) with ESMTP id m6U7ksBJ022350 for <@sunmail2sca.sfbay.sun.com:lsarc-ext@sun.com>; Wed, 30 Jul 2008 15:46:58 +0800 (SGT) Received: from pmxchannel-daemon.nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM by nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-3.04 (built Jul 15 2005)) id <0K4T00J016Y87Q00@nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM> for lsarc-ext@sun.com (ORCPT lsarc-ext@sun.com); Wed, 30 Jul 2008 00:46:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sineb-mail-2.sun.com ([192.18.19.7]) by nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-3.04 (built Jul 15 2005)) with ESMTP id <0K4T00GRK6Y7QAB0@nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM> for lsarc-ext@sun.com (ORCPT lsarc-ext@sun.com); Wed, 30 Jul 2008 00:46:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from fe-apac-05.sun.com (fe-apac-05.sun.com [192.18.19.176] (may be forged)) by sineb-mail-2.sun.com (8.13.6+Sun/8.12.9) with ESMTP id m6U7ks3i007039 for ; Wed, 30 Jul 2008 07:46:54 +0000 (GMT) Received: from conversion-daemon.mail-apac.sun.com by mail-apac.sun.com (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) id <0K4T00M016TZXJ00@mail-apac.sun.com> (original mail from Irene.Huang@Sun.COM) for lsarc-ext@sun.com (ORCPT lsarc-ext@sun.com); Wed, 30 Jul 2008 15:46:54 +0800 (SGT) Received: from [129.158.217.138] by mail-apac.sun.com (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTPSA id <0K4T00M7X6Y5LRDE@mail-apac.sun.com>; Wed, 30 Jul 2008 15:46:54 +0800 (SGT) Date: Wed, 30 Jul 2008 15:47:54 +0800 From: Irene Huang Subject: Re: avant-window-navigator for OpenSolaris [LSARC/2008/452 FastTrack timeout 07/22/2008] In-reply-to: <488FCE9A.8000208@sun.com> Sender: Irene.Huang@sun.com To: Henry Zhang Cc: Brian Cameron , Shi-Ying Irene Huang , lsarc-ext@sun.com Message-id: <1217404074.29989.2.camel@goalie> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Evolution 2.22.2 Content-type: text/plain Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT X-PMX-Version: 5.4.1.325704 References: <200807160734.m6G7YjaG013861@sac.sfbay.sun.com> <48860874.7080700@sun.com> <488891A8.2000100@sun.com> <488A01F1.6020209@sun.com> <488EF7CE.3080401@sun.com> <488FCE9A.8000208@sun.com> Status: RO Content-Length: 11384 Hi, All I am reseting the timeout to be August 4th. --Irene On Wed, 2008-07-30 at 10:14 +0800, Henry Zhang wrote: > Hi all, > > I made some changes on the proposal to make it neat, please check. > Thank Brian for review... > > Regards, > Henry > > Henry Zhang 写道: > > Hi Brain, See my answer in-line, > > > > And I finished the proposal to add some change from the discussing, see > > attachement. > > > > Thanks, > > Henry > > > > Brian Cameron 写道: > >> > >> Henry: > >> > >>>> What is the accessibility impact of this new mechanism of accessing > >>>> "applet like things"? Does this "just work" with accessibility? If > >>>> not, what is our plan to make it accessible? > >>> > >>> AWN is used to manage the running task, and some applets. We can use > >>> Ctl+Alt+Tab to access the running task, it should be accessibility > >>> support. > >>> For the applets in AWN, no way to access them through keyboard by now. > >> > >> I think it would be good to discuss some sort of get-well plan for a11y > >> in the materials. > > > > These days I discussed accessibility support with the community, they > > confirm me that they have not consider this issue, I will try to push > > them to see if they can do some work on it, at least I can see they > > begin to think add some support so that user can access AWN by keyboard. > > And by now we can use Ctl+Alt+Tab to switch in the running applications, > > so these should be support accessibility. > >> > >>>> Also, how does this relate to gDesklets? Although giving users choice > >>>> to customize their desktop is a good thing, I hope we aren't going to > >>>> end up with a mish-mash of random eyecandy that doesn't work well or > >>>> integrate together. > >>> > >>> There is no confliction between gDesklets and AWN, gDesklets used to > >>> place the applets to desktop, AWN will run applets in its dock. The > >>> applets is different, for gDesklets, using .display file, while AWN > >>> need .desktop file in the applet package. > >> > >> Might be good to explain the relationship between gnome-panel, > >> gDesklets, and avant-window-navigator in the materials a bit more. > > Added soome explanation on Details of the proposal. > >> > >>>> Do users need to compile code to install a new applet, or are the > >>>> applets interpreted (e.g. Python code) so that users can just > >>>> install an > >>>> applet and it will just work without needing to do extra complicated > >>>> things like compile code? > >>> > >>> Yes, for Python applet, user can use awn-manager to install directly, > >>> no compile needed. For C, need to build and install. > >> > >> That's good to hear. You could also explain this in the materials a bit > >> more. > > > > Added soome explanation on Details of the proposal. > >> > >>>>> If someone develop the applet for AWN, should follow Applet > >>>>> Submission at http://wiki.awn-project.org/Awn_Extras:Applet_Submission > >>>> > >>>> Could you give some examples of what sorts of applets are available for > >>>> this framework? > >>> > >>> See http://wiki.awn-project.org/Applets:DevelopmentGuidelines, where > >>> list the detailed guideline on what the applet should be. > >>> You also can download awn-extras, there are some stable example. > >> > >> It doesn't seem like we have spent enough effort figuring out which > >> plugins we should/could be including by default. Wouldn't > >> avant-window-navigator be more useful if we shipped some plugin > >> features with it? > > They generally used to make the display effect better to look, so not > > necessary. > >> Do other distros ship any plugins with it? > >> Perhaps we should follow the general community lead here. Though > >> this could also be managed in a separate case, rather than this > >> case. > > From the webpage, the plugin is with awn-extras, so should in another > > project. And most of plugins are Ubuntu-special. > >> > >>>> What applets are installed by default and what do they do? > >>> > >>> Currently from what I can see, there is only 1 applet installed by > >>> default, it is Launch/Taskmanager, in order to add some other, have > >>> to use awn-extras. > >> > >> It would be nice if the case materials explained more about the one > >> applet that is installed by default, and what it does, in more detail. > > Added soome explanation on Details of the proposal. > > > >> > >>>> How active are third parties or individuals at creating applets? > >>> It really depend on the individual who like to contribute his applet > >>> to AWN, from what I can see, there definitely are quite some new > >>> applets provided by some developers. > >> > >> There sure are. I'm curious what applets other distributions might be > >> including by default. > > In AWN, by default there is only one applet, all other applets need to > > be added by awn-extras, I discussed with the community yesterday, they > > told me "There are some plans to include more applets in the core > > installation." > >> > >>>> I notice the Applet Gallery you describe is here: > >>>> http://wiki.awn-project.org/Applet_Gallery > >>>> > >>>> Which ones will we be shipping, if any? > >>> Most of the applets listed in Gallery are just in awn-extra, also > >>> there are some applets contributed by some developers, awn-extras is > >>> another different project, I tried to build it, failed, because all > >>> of applets are in this package, some applet need different > >>> dependencies, some of them are missing on Solaris, e.g. > >>> python-alsaaudio. > >> > >> On Solaris, we support SunAudio and will hopefully soon support OSS. So > >> any applets which depend on ALSA would obviously not work. It would be > >> nice if we provided (at the very least) a spec-file in spec-files-extra > >> to allow people to more easily build whatever extra plugins do work on > >> Solaris. > > Will do once got time.. > >> > >>>> Although it does look cool, I worry that it will confuse users if we > >>>> provide another interface that works very similar to gnome-panel. I > >>>> would appreciate more information about what our future plans are. > >>>> Will > >>>> avant-window-navigator replace gnome-panel, will it be used together > >>>> with gnome-panel, or is it expected that users will pick one or the > >>>> other to use? Perhaps you could explain a bit how you expect users > >>>> would actually use this in relation to gnome-panel. > >>> > >>> Yes, It's a big concern now, we have gnome-panel, should we ship AWN? > >>> At the moment, AWN can't replace gnome-panel, reason below: > >>> 1, AWN need compositing support, it means before run AWN, you have to > >>> make Compiz start, then AWN can run, so in the non-Compiz > >>> environment, we can only use gnome-panel. > >>> 2, There is no launch menu by default in AWN, and the AWN menu can't > >>> updates when applications are installed. > >>> 3, Trash in AWN is not stable enough now. > >>> 4, maybe something others I did not dig out.. > >> > >> Whether we ship AWN for these reasons is obviously a business decision > >> for the team to make. It shouldn't affect whether the ARC case is > >> approved or not. It might make most sense to integrate it when the > >> above issues are addressed. However, I would make sure you file bugs > >> upstream (probably with both the AWN and gnome-panel projects) to see > >> if we can encourage the upstream maintainers to address some of these > >> issues (along with the a11y issues). > >> > >> I'd talk it over with your project team. > > Yes, I did discuss with the project team, and I noticed they have > > realized these issue, and discussing how to fix them, but no schedule now. > >> > >>>> If they are intended to be used together, then is it likely that users > >>>> be confused by having two sets of interfaces that do very similar > >>>> things? > >>> > >>> Yes, this issue also bother me, so I'd say AWN can provide some > >>> different experience which gnome-panel can't provide, e.g. 3D.. > >>> So if user like to taste, he can download and use it. > >> > >> Right. > >> > >>>> managers (metacity and compiz). Users can easily manage switching > >>>> between the two because the GNOME configuration dialogs allows users to > >>>> pick which one they will use. This way users are prevented from > >>>> possibly trying to run both at the same time, making a more sane user > >>>> experience. Is switching back and forth between gnome-panel and > >>>> avant-window-navigator managed in a similar simple fashion? > >>> > >>> by now it's impossible to switch between them, because we can't > >>> remove gnome-panel. > >> > >> Seems it would be neat to enhance the desktop so users could more easily > >> switch between them if they wanted. > > Yes, I agree, so in Ubuntu, they generally close the gnome-panel at the > > bottom, and only make the top panel run, and AWN run at the bottom of > > screen, I think we can do in this way, and it's planned that AWN will be > > placed anywhere of screen, so in the future, we can make these 2 work > > together better.. > > > >> > >>>> Will we be integrating any of these Extra plugins with this case, or a > >>>> separate case? Or are you just informing us that end users can install > >>>> additional applets if they wish? > >>> > >>> They should be in awn-extras, it's another project, we may consider > >>> to deliver it separately. > >> > >> Makes sense. > >> > >> Brian > plain text document attachment (awn-project-plan.txt) > Item Name Owner Start Date Expected Completion comments > > Project Plan > > ARC one-pager Done. > > ARC fast track ongoing > > Open Source Review done > > ECCN Not start > > Porting done > > spec/SUNWspec file done to spec-files-other/core > > copyright file done to spec-files-other/copyright > > G11n done need send a request to Takao.Fujiwara@Sun.COM and cc desktop-discuss@opensolaris.org > > launch menu, done need to send the .desktop file to calum benson, have a description of your project and why you want to put it to the menu. > > ARC Material not start dump -Lv/ CLI.txt(--help)/ manpage / schemas/ pkgmap > > manpage not start > > test&fix not start > > ======================= Not necessary ============================================== > Cteam Checklist HenryZ Mar. 1 07 Mar. 15 07 Not necessary > > Contract HenryZ Mar. 20 07 Mar. 30 07 ongoing > > TPT HenryZ Mar. 19 07 Mar. 21 07 Done. And store at /net/solaris.eng/benet/S11/TPT/JDS/virt-manager > > "What's New" Form at http://releaseme.sfbay/new_features_input.html > > Write Test Plan PatrickG Dec. 18 06 Dec. 23 06 Done, > > UI review Calum Nov. 21 06 Nov. 30 06 Have sent mail to Calum, > > Pre-integration Test PatrickG Mar. 22 07 Apr. 15 07 Preparing by Patrick Gu > > A11Y testing TimM Mar. 22 07 Apr. 20 07 Need confirm from TimM > > L10n HelenW Dec. 25 06 Jan. 01 07 Need confirm from HelenW > > TOI > > Doc plan manpages, project plan, TPT, What's New doc(S10U) etc. > > Pre-integ Bug Fixing HenryZ Apr. 15 07 Apr. 30 07 B65 code freeze date is May 4 07, but there is holiday on May 1~7 > From Hua.Zhang@sun.com Wed Jul 30 19:42:05 2008 Received: from sunmail4.singapore.sun.com (sunmail4.Singapore.Sun.COM [129.158.71.19]) by sac.sfbay.sun.com (8.13.8+Sun/8.13.8) with ESMTP id m6V2g4S4015098 for ; Wed, 30 Jul 2008 19:42:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from brm-avmta-1.central.sun.com (brm-avmta-1.Central.Sun.COM [129.147.4.11]) by sunmail4.singapore.sun.com (8.13.4+Sun/8.13.3/ENSMAIL,v2.2) with ESMTP id m6V2fxLl006927 for <@sunmail2sca.sfbay.sun.com:lsarc-ext@sun.com>; Thu, 31 Jul 2008 10:42:03 +0800 (SGT) Received: from pmxchannel-daemon.brm-avmta-1.central.sun.com by brm-avmta-1.central.sun.com (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-3.04 (built Jul 15 2005)) id <0K4U00M01NHZS100@brm-avmta-1.central.sun.com> for lsarc-ext@sun.com (ORCPT lsarc-ext@sun.com); Wed, 30 Jul 2008 20:41:59 -0600 (MDT) Received: from sineb-mail-2.sun.com ([192.18.19.7]) by brm-avmta-1.central.sun.com (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-3.04 (built Jul 15 2005)) with ESMTP id <0K4U000HSNHXQ5C0@brm-avmta-1.central.sun.com> for lsarc-ext@sun.com (ORCPT lsarc-ext@sun.com); Wed, 30 Jul 2008 20:41:59 -0600 (MDT) Received: from fe-apac-05.sun.com (fe-apac-05.sun.com [192.18.19.176] (may be forged)) by sineb-mail-2.sun.com (8.13.6+Sun/8.12.9) with ESMTP id m6V2fvRn011780 for ; Thu, 31 Jul 2008 02:41:57 +0000 (GMT) Received: from conversion-daemon.mail-apac.sun.com by mail-apac.sun.com (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) id <0K4U00M01NC4BF00@mail-apac.sun.com> (original mail from Hua.Zhang@Sun.COM) for lsarc-ext@sun.com (ORCPT lsarc-ext@sun.com); Thu, 31 Jul 2008 10:41:57 +0800 (SGT) Received: from [129.158.217.156] by mail-apac.sun.com (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTPSA id <0K4U007PHNHMUH2Z@mail-apac.sun.com>; Thu, 31 Jul 2008 10:41:47 +0800 (SGT) Date: Thu, 31 Jul 2008 10:45:33 +0800 From: Henry Zhang Subject: Re: avant-window-navigator for OpenSolaris [LSARC/2008/452 FastTrack timeout 07/22/2008] In-reply-to: <488FCE9A.8000208@sun.com> Sender: Hua.Zhang@sun.com To: Henry Zhang Cc: Brian Cameron , Shi-Ying Irene Huang , lsarc-ext@sun.com Message-id: <4891274D.8090907@sun.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/mixed; boundary="Boundary_(ID_z0p6p/zrfaHDG7YwkPRo3g)" X-PMX-Version: 5.4.1.325704 References: <200807160734.m6G7YjaG013861@sac.sfbay.sun.com> <48860874.7080700@sun.com> <488891A8.2000100@sun.com> <488A01F1.6020209@sun.com> <488EF7CE.3080401@sun.com> <488FCE9A.8000208@sun.com> User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.6 (X11/20071119) Status: RO Content-Length: 20200 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --Boundary_(ID_z0p6p/zrfaHDG7YwkPRo3g) Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=UTF-8 Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT Have to resend because of wrong attachment.. Now the correct one is attached.. ;) Thanks, Henry Henry Zhang 写道: > Hi all, > > I made some changes on the proposal to make it neat, please check. > Thank Brian for review... > > Regards, > Henry > > Henry Zhang 写道: >> Hi Brain, See my answer in-line, >> >> And I finished the proposal to add some change from the discussing, >> see attachement. >> >> Thanks, >> Henry >> >> Brian Cameron 写道: >>> >>> Henry: >>> >>>>> What is the accessibility impact of this new mechanism of accessing >>>>> "applet like things"? Does this "just work" with accessibility? If >>>>> not, what is our plan to make it accessible? >>>> >>>> AWN is used to manage the running task, and some applets. We can use >>>> Ctl+Alt+Tab to access the running task, it should be accessibility >>>> support. >>>> For the applets in AWN, no way to access them through keyboard by now. >>> >>> I think it would be good to discuss some sort of get-well plan for a11y >>> in the materials. >> >> These days I discussed accessibility support with the community, they >> confirm me that they have not consider this issue, I will try to push >> them to see if they can do some work on it, at least I can see they >> begin to think add some support so that user can access AWN by keyboard. >> And by now we can use Ctl+Alt+Tab to switch in the running >> applications, so these should be support accessibility. >>> >>>>> Also, how does this relate to gDesklets? Although giving users choice >>>>> to customize their desktop is a good thing, I hope we aren't going to >>>>> end up with a mish-mash of random eyecandy that doesn't work well or >>>>> integrate together. >>>> >>>> There is no confliction between gDesklets and AWN, gDesklets used to >>>> place the applets to desktop, AWN will run applets in its dock. The >>>> applets is different, for gDesklets, using .display file, while AWN >>>> need .desktop file in the applet package. >>> >>> Might be good to explain the relationship between gnome-panel, >>> gDesklets, and avant-window-navigator in the materials a bit more. >> Added soome explanation on Details of the proposal. >>> >>>>> Do users need to compile code to install a new applet, or are the >>>>> applets interpreted (e.g. Python code) so that users can just >>>>> install an >>>>> applet and it will just work without needing to do extra complicated >>>>> things like compile code? >>>> >>>> Yes, for Python applet, user can use awn-manager to install >>>> directly, no compile needed. For C, need to build and install. >>> >>> That's good to hear. You could also explain this in the materials a bit >>> more. >> >> Added soome explanation on Details of the proposal. >>> >>>>>> If someone develop the applet for AWN, should follow Applet >>>>>> Submission at >>>>>> http://wiki.awn-project.org/Awn_Extras:Applet_Submission >>>>> >>>>> Could you give some examples of what sorts of applets are available >>>>> for >>>>> this framework? >>>> >>>> See http://wiki.awn-project.org/Applets:DevelopmentGuidelines, where >>>> list the detailed guideline on what the applet should be. >>>> You also can download awn-extras, there are some stable example. >>> >>> It doesn't seem like we have spent enough effort figuring out which >>> plugins we should/could be including by default. Wouldn't >>> avant-window-navigator be more useful if we shipped some plugin >>> features with it? >> They generally used to make the display effect better to look, so not >> necessary. >>> Do other distros ship any plugins with it? >>> Perhaps we should follow the general community lead here. Though >>> this could also be managed in a separate case, rather than this >>> case. >> From the webpage, the plugin is with awn-extras, so should in another >> project. And most of plugins are Ubuntu-special. >>> >>>>> What applets are installed by default and what do they do? >>>> >>>> Currently from what I can see, there is only 1 applet installed by >>>> default, it is Launch/Taskmanager, in order to add some other, have >>>> to use awn-extras. >>> >>> It would be nice if the case materials explained more about the one >>> applet that is installed by default, and what it does, in more detail. >> Added soome explanation on Details of the proposal. >> >>> >>>>> How active are third parties or individuals at creating applets? >>>> It really depend on the individual who like to contribute his applet >>>> to AWN, from what I can see, there definitely are quite some new >>>> applets provided by some developers. >>> >>> There sure are. I'm curious what applets other distributions might be >>> including by default. >> In AWN, by default there is only one applet, all other applets need to >> be added by awn-extras, I discussed with the community yesterday, they >> told me "There are some plans to include more applets in the core >> installation." >>> >>>>> I notice the Applet Gallery you describe is here: >>>>> http://wiki.awn-project.org/Applet_Gallery >>>>> >>>>> Which ones will we be shipping, if any? >>>> Most of the applets listed in Gallery are just in awn-extra, also >>>> there are some applets contributed by some developers, awn-extras is >>>> another different project, I tried to build it, failed, because all >>>> of applets are in this package, some applet need different >>>> dependencies, some of them are missing on Solaris, e.g. >>>> python-alsaaudio. >>> >>> On Solaris, we support SunAudio and will hopefully soon support OSS. So >>> any applets which depend on ALSA would obviously not work. It would be >>> nice if we provided (at the very least) a spec-file in spec-files-extra >>> to allow people to more easily build whatever extra plugins do work on >>> Solaris. >> Will do once got time.. >>> >>>>> Although it does look cool, I worry that it will confuse users if we >>>>> provide another interface that works very similar to gnome-panel. I >>>>> would appreciate more information about what our future plans are. >>>>> Will >>>>> avant-window-navigator replace gnome-panel, will it be used together >>>>> with gnome-panel, or is it expected that users will pick one or the >>>>> other to use? Perhaps you could explain a bit how you expect users >>>>> would actually use this in relation to gnome-panel. >>>> >>>> Yes, It's a big concern now, we have gnome-panel, should we ship AWN? >>>> At the moment, AWN can't replace gnome-panel, reason below: >>>> 1, AWN need compositing support, it means before run AWN, you have >>>> to make Compiz start, then AWN can run, so in the non-Compiz >>>> environment, we can only use gnome-panel. >>>> 2, There is no launch menu by default in AWN, and the AWN menu can't >>>> updates when applications are installed. >>>> 3, Trash in AWN is not stable enough now. >>>> 4, maybe something others I did not dig out.. >>> >>> Whether we ship AWN for these reasons is obviously a business decision >>> for the team to make. It shouldn't affect whether the ARC case is >>> approved or not. It might make most sense to integrate it when the >>> above issues are addressed. However, I would make sure you file bugs >>> upstream (probably with both the AWN and gnome-panel projects) to see >>> if we can encourage the upstream maintainers to address some of these >>> issues (along with the a11y issues). >>> >>> I'd talk it over with your project team. >> Yes, I did discuss with the project team, and I noticed they have >> realized these issue, and discussing how to fix them, but no schedule >> now. >>> >>>>> If they are intended to be used together, then is it likely that users >>>>> be confused by having two sets of interfaces that do very similar >>>>> things? >>>> >>>> Yes, this issue also bother me, so I'd say AWN can provide some >>>> different experience which gnome-panel can't provide, e.g. 3D.. >>>> So if user like to taste, he can download and use it. >>> >>> Right. >>> >>>>> managers (metacity and compiz). Users can easily manage switching >>>>> between the two because the GNOME configuration dialogs allows >>>>> users to >>>>> pick which one they will use. This way users are prevented from >>>>> possibly trying to run both at the same time, making a more sane user >>>>> experience. Is switching back and forth between gnome-panel and >>>>> avant-window-navigator managed in a similar simple fashion? >>>> >>>> by now it's impossible to switch between them, because we can't >>>> remove gnome-panel. >>> >>> Seems it would be neat to enhance the desktop so users could more easily >>> switch between them if they wanted. >> Yes, I agree, so in Ubuntu, they generally close the gnome-panel at >> the bottom, and only make the top panel run, and AWN run at the bottom >> of screen, I think we can do in this way, and it's planned that AWN >> will be placed anywhere of screen, so in the future, we can make these >> 2 work together better.. >> >>> >>>>> Will we be integrating any of these Extra plugins with this case, or a >>>>> separate case? Or are you just informing us that end users can >>>>> install >>>>> additional applets if they wish? >>>> >>>> They should be in awn-extras, it's another project, we may consider >>>> to deliver it separately. >>> >>> Makes sense. >>> >>> Brian --Boundary_(ID_z0p6p/zrfaHDG7YwkPRo3g) Content-type: text/plain; name=proposal-one-pager-awn.txt Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline; filename=proposal-one-pager-awn.txt Template Version: @(#)onepager.txt 1.29 04/11/15 SMI 1. Introduction 1.1. Project/Component Working Name: Avant-window-navigator 1.2. Name of Document Author/Supplier: Henry Zhang (hua.zhang@sun.com) 1.3. Date of This Document: 10/07/08 1.4. Name of Major Document Customer(s)/Consumer(s): 1.4.1. The PAC or CPT you expect to review your project: Solaris PAC 1.4.2. The ARC(s) you expect to review your project: LSARC 1.4.3. The Director/VP who is "Sponsoring" this project: Robert.Odea@Sun.Com 1.4.4. The name of your business unit: JDS Desktop Engineering, OPG 1.5. Email Aliases: 1.5.1. Responsible Manager: leo.binchy@Sun.COM 1.5.2. Responsible Engineer: hua.zhang@Sun.COM 1.5.3. Marketing Manager: jeff.mcmeekin@sun.com 1.5.4. Interest List: awn@sun.com 2. Project Summary 2.1. Project Description: Avant Window Navigator (AWN/Awn) is a dock-like navigation bar for the desktop. 2.2. Risks and Assumptions: 1. The AWN manager allows users to easily download and install new applets from the Applet Gallery. There is a risk that a user might install additional applets which might not work properly due to a missing dependency, or because they are not stable. So if user like to add new applets, should go to Applet Gallery, and install the stable ones. If someone develop the applet for AWN, should follow Applet Submission at http://wiki.awn-project.org/Awn_Extras:Applet_Submission 2. AWN does not support accessibility at the moment, the community has not consider this before, so need to take some push so to make it support accessibility. Currently user can use Ctl+Alt+Tab to switch between the running applications, so this supports some degree of accessibility 3. Business Summary 3.1. Problem Area: Now all of the Operating System is providing the desktop tool for user to view and control system, user can start many applications in the system, so it's useful to provide user a GUI tool to list all of the running applications, and user can use it to active/deactive the application or access some location by simply click one icon. This project provides an alternative GUI panel for easier navigation of running applications and the filesystem. 3.2. Market/Requester: JDS Desktop group 3.3. Business Justification: AWN provides an alternative GUI panel which displays a dock-like bar at the bottom of the screen. It shows the user all of their running applications and allows users to easily switch between them. It also allows users to specify commonly used folders on the filesystem which will be shown to the user so they can quickly navigate to them by clicking on an icon. User can also install additional applets from the upstream community if they wish. 3.4. Competitive Analysis: AWN has a similar approach to the panel as the Leopard dock in MacOS. 3.5. Opportunity Window/Exposure: It is expected that this project will be integrated into Nevada B99. 3.6. How will you know when you are done?: When it is ported to Nevada and runs correctly. The project will be complete when there are no stoppers, P1 or P2 bugs. 4. Technical Description: 4.1. Details: Avant Window Navigator (AWN/Awn) is a dock-like navigation bar for the desktop that positions itself at the bottom of the screen. And it can be used to keep track of open windows and behaves like the gnome-panel window list applet. You can also add a place or location (home folder or a drive for example) to the dock, so users have more control of their computer just from the dock. AWN also has the ability to embed external applets. Look and feel are fully customisable, and theming support is also available. AWN ships with only the Launcher/Taskmanager applet by default, which is used to manage the launcher and task running. Many other applets, such as the Main Menu, "Stacks", CPU meter, and GMail notifier applets can be found in Awn Extras. After installing additional applets, users can install them to the dock via awn-manager in the "Applets" section. Users also can develop plugins for AWN, which allow already-existing applications to interact with AWN. Awn Extras is a project focusing on providing a number of important applets (not unlike the panel applets for Gnome and Xfce) in a single package, along with a number of plugins that allow applications to better interface with Awn's task manager. These applets range from a Trash applet to fancy workspace switcher. To obtain them, follow the Awn Extras download instructions. You will find plugins in /awn-extras/awn-plugins. If users wish to develop their own applets, it's easy enough. If the applet is written in Python, you can install it directly, no need to compile, but if it is in C or Vala, Makefile will be provided to handle the installation details properly, then you can compile and install. Now on Solaris we have gnome-panel run by default, and AWN is also the Similar tool. At the moment, AWN will not replace gnome-panel. Instead, these programs are intended to be run together. Reasons why we cannot replace gnome-panel with AWN include: * 1, AWN need compositing support. Before can run AWN, you have to start Compiz, and then AWN can run, so in a non-Compiz environment, we can only use gnome-panel. * 2, There is no launch menu by default in AWN, and the AWN menu can't updates when applications are installed. * 3, Trash in AWN is not stable enough now. We also ship gDesklets on Solaris. gDesklets provides applet-like objects which display on the desktop background. These compliment whatever style of panel the user may be using, whether they are using gnome-panel or AWN. 4.2. Bug/RFE Number(s): N/A 4.3. In Scope: The applets included into the core distribution of AWN 4.4. Out of Scope: Applets developed by third party developers and the ones in awn-extras. 4.5. Interfaces: Imported Interfaces Interface Stability Comments ------------------- ----------- ----------------------------------- X11 libraries & protocols Standard ASARC 1995/265, PSARC 1998/299 libXrender.so.1 External dbus Volatile LSARC/2006/368 libXdamage External LSARC/2003/506 libXcomposite Volatile PSARC/2007/240 gnome-python2-gconf Uncommitted LSARC/2005/506 gnome-python-desktop Volatile LSARC/2006/202 Python Volatile PSARC/2005/532, PSARC/2006/290 PSARC/2006/290 GNOME Committed Platform Libraries Committed LSARC/2007/520 GTK+ library GNOME 2.20 Exported Interfaces Stability Comments ------------------------- ------------- --------------------------------- /usr/bin/awn-applet-activation Volatile /usr/bin/avant-window-navigator Volatile /usr/bin/awn-launcher-editor Volatile /usr/bin/awn-manager Volatile /usr/bin/awn-schema-to-gconf Volatile SUNWavant Uncommitted Package name SUNWavant-devel Uncommitted Package name SUNWavant-root Uncommitted Package name 4.6. Doc Impact: Man page will need to be added 4.7. Admin/Config Impact: There are no changes to the system administration and configuration. 4.8. HA Impact: N/A 4.9. I18N/L10N Impact: To be needed 4.10. Packaging & Delivery: The new packages are: - SUNWavant - SUNWavant-devel - SUNWavant-root 4.11. Security Impact: There is no additional security impact for Solaris. 4.12. Dependencies: libwnck-1.0 gnome-desktop-2.0 libgnome-2.0 gnome-vfs-2.0 gconf-2.0 x11 xproto dbus-glib-1 libglade-2.0 xdamage xcomposite xrender python2.5-dev python-gnome2-dev python-gnome2-desktop-dev python-gnome2-extras-dev 5. Reference Documents: Avant Window Navigator main project page: http://launchpad.net/awn Avant Window Navigator Wiki: http://wiki.awn-project.org/ Avant Window Navigator Forum: http://www.planetblur.org/hosted/awnforum 6. Resources and Schedule: 6.1. Projected Availability: Expect to integrated into Nevada in build 99 in Q3 2008 6.2. Cost of Effort: Development 1.0 Engineers - 1 Months Testing 0.5 Engineers - 1 Week RE 0.5 Engineers - 1 Week 6.3. Cost of Capital Resources: N/A 6.4. Product Approval Committee requested information: 6.4.1. Consolidation or Component Name: JDS / OpenSolaris 6.4.3. Type of CPT Review and Approval expected: Standard 6.4.4. Project Boundary Conditions: None 6.4.5. Is this a necessary project for OEM agreements: No 6.4.6. Notes: N/A 6.4.7. Target RTI Date/Release: Nevada B99 - August 2008 6.4.8. Target Code Design Review Date: August 2008 6.4.9. Update approval addition: New project, no Solaris PAC approval yet 6.5. ARC review type: FastTrack 7. Prototype Availability: 7.1. Prototype Availability: August 2008 7.2. Prototype Cost: 1 engineer 1 QA 1 RE --Boundary_(ID_z0p6p/zrfaHDG7YwkPRo3g)-- From Irene.Huang@sun.com Sun Aug 3 19:55:03 2008 Received: from sunmail4.singapore.sun.com (sunmail4.Singapore.Sun.COM [129.158.71.19]) by sac.sfbay.sun.com (8.13.8+Sun/8.13.8) with ESMTP id m742t26H000756 for ; Sun, 3 Aug 2008 19:55:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nwk-avmta-1.SFBay.Sun.COM (nwk-avmta-1.SFBay.Sun.COM [129.146.11.74]) by sunmail4.singapore.sun.com (8.13.4+Sun/8.13.3/ENSMAIL,v2.2) with ESMTP id m742spQc011561 for <@sunmail2sca.sfbay.sun.com:lsarc-ext@sun.com>; Mon, 4 Aug 2008 10:55:01 +0800 (SGT) Received: from pmxchannel-daemon.nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM by nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-3.04 (built Jul 15 2005)) id <0K52000012RNCV00@nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM> for lsarc-ext@sun.com (ORCPT lsarc-ext@sun.com); Sun, 03 Aug 2008 19:54:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sineb-mail-1.sun.com ([192.18.19.6]) by nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-3.04 (built Jul 15 2005)) with ESMTP id <0K52008GX2RM10D0@nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM> for lsarc-ext@sun.com (ORCPT lsarc-ext@sun.com); Sun, 03 Aug 2008 19:54:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: from fe-apac-05.sun.com (fe-apac-05.sun.com [192.18.19.176] (may be forged)) by sineb-mail-1.sun.com (8.13.6+Sun/8.12.9) with ESMTP id m742svvE021728 for ; Mon, 04 Aug 2008 02:54:57 +0000 (GMT) Received: from conversion-daemon.mail-apac.sun.com by mail-apac.sun.com (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) id <0K52008012O60N00@mail-apac.sun.com> (original mail from Irene.Huang@Sun.COM) for lsarc-ext@sun.com (ORCPT lsarc-ext@sun.com); Mon, 04 Aug 2008 10:54:57 +0800 (SGT) Received: from [129.158.217.138] by mail-apac.sun.com (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTPSA id <0K5200MY32RKLRGL@mail-apac.sun.com>; Mon, 04 Aug 2008 10:54:57 +0800 (SGT) Date: Mon, 04 Aug 2008 10:56:01 +0800 From: Irene Huang Subject: Re: avant-window-navigator for OpenSolaris [LSARC/2008/452 FastTrack timeout 07/22/2008] In-reply-to: <1217404074.29989.2.camel@goalie> Sender: Irene.Huang@sun.com To: Henry Zhang Cc: Brian Cameron , Shi-Ying Irene Huang , lsarc-ext@sun.com Message-id: <1217818561.3807.4.camel@goalie> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Evolution 2.22.2 Content-type: text/plain Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT X-PMX-Version: 5.4.1.325704 References: <200807160734.m6G7YjaG013861@sac.sfbay.sun.com> <48860874.7080700@sun.com> <488891A8.2000100@sun.com> <488A01F1.6020209@sun.com> <488EF7CE.3080401@sun.com> <488FCE9A.8000208@sun.com> <1217404074.29989.2.camel@goalie> Status: RO Content-Length: 12069 If there's objections within 24 hours, I'd like to close this case as approved then. Thanks --irene On Wed, 2008-07-30 at 15:47 +0800, Irene Huang wrote: > Hi, All > > I am reseting the timeout to be August 4th. > > --Irene > On Wed, 2008-07-30 at 10:14 +0800, Henry Zhang wrote: > > Hi all, > > > > I made some changes on the proposal to make it neat, please check. > > Thank Brian for review... > > > > Regards, > > Henry > > > > Henry Zhang 写道: > > > Hi Brain, See my answer in-line, > > > > > > And I finished the proposal to add some change from the discussing, see > > > attachement. > > > > > > Thanks, > > > Henry > > > > > > Brian Cameron 写道: > > >> > > >> Henry: > > >> > > >>>> What is the accessibility impact of this new mechanism of accessing > > >>>> "applet like things"? Does this "just work" with accessibility? If > > >>>> not, what is our plan to make it accessible? > > >>> > > >>> AWN is used to manage the running task, and some applets. We can use > > >>> Ctl+Alt+Tab to access the running task, it should be accessibility > > >>> support. > > >>> For the applets in AWN, no way to access them through keyboard by now. > > >> > > >> I think it would be good to discuss some sort of get-well plan for a11y > > >> in the materials. > > > > > > These days I discussed accessibility support with the community, they > > > confirm me that they have not consider this issue, I will try to push > > > them to see if they can do some work on it, at least I can see they > > > begin to think add some support so that user can access AWN by keyboard. > > > And by now we can use Ctl+Alt+Tab to switch in the running applications, > > > so these should be support accessibility. > > >> > > >>>> Also, how does this relate to gDesklets? Although giving users choice > > >>>> to customize their desktop is a good thing, I hope we aren't going to > > >>>> end up with a mish-mash of random eyecandy that doesn't work well or > > >>>> integrate together. > > >>> > > >>> There is no confliction between gDesklets and AWN, gDesklets used to > > >>> place the applets to desktop, AWN will run applets in its dock. The > > >>> applets is different, for gDesklets, using .display file, while AWN > > >>> need .desktop file in the applet package. > > >> > > >> Might be good to explain the relationship between gnome-panel, > > >> gDesklets, and avant-window-navigator in the materials a bit more. > > > Added soome explanation on Details of the proposal. > > >> > > >>>> Do users need to compile code to install a new applet, or are the > > >>>> applets interpreted (e.g. Python code) so that users can just > > >>>> install an > > >>>> applet and it will just work without needing to do extra complicated > > >>>> things like compile code? > > >>> > > >>> Yes, for Python applet, user can use awn-manager to install directly, > > >>> no compile needed. For C, need to build and install. > > >> > > >> That's good to hear. You could also explain this in the materials a bit > > >> more. > > > > > > Added soome explanation on Details of the proposal. > > >> > > >>>>> If someone develop the applet for AWN, should follow Applet > > >>>>> Submission at http://wiki.awn-project.org/Awn_Extras:Applet_Submission > > >>>> > > >>>> Could you give some examples of what sorts of applets are available for > > >>>> this framework? > > >>> > > >>> See http://wiki.awn-project.org/Applets:DevelopmentGuidelines, where > > >>> list the detailed guideline on what the applet should be. > > >>> You also can download awn-extras, there are some stable example. > > >> > > >> It doesn't seem like we have spent enough effort figuring out which > > >> plugins we should/could be including by default. Wouldn't > > >> avant-window-navigator be more useful if we shipped some plugin > > >> features with it? > > > They generally used to make the display effect better to look, so not > > > necessary. > > >> Do other distros ship any plugins with it? > > >> Perhaps we should follow the general community lead here. Though > > >> this could also be managed in a separate case, rather than this > > >> case. > > > From the webpage, the plugin is with awn-extras, so should in another > > > project. And most of plugins are Ubuntu-special. > > >> > > >>>> What applets are installed by default and what do they do? > > >>> > > >>> Currently from what I can see, there is only 1 applet installed by > > >>> default, it is Launch/Taskmanager, in order to add some other, have > > >>> to use awn-extras. > > >> > > >> It would be nice if the case materials explained more about the one > > >> applet that is installed by default, and what it does, in more detail. > > > Added soome explanation on Details of the proposal. > > > > > >> > > >>>> How active are third parties or individuals at creating applets? > > >>> It really depend on the individual who like to contribute his applet > > >>> to AWN, from what I can see, there definitely are quite some new > > >>> applets provided by some developers. > > >> > > >> There sure are. I'm curious what applets other distributions might be > > >> including by default. > > > In AWN, by default there is only one applet, all other applets need to > > > be added by awn-extras, I discussed with the community yesterday, they > > > told me "There are some plans to include more applets in the core > > > installation." > > >> > > >>>> I notice the Applet Gallery you describe is here: > > >>>> http://wiki.awn-project.org/Applet_Gallery > > >>>> > > >>>> Which ones will we be shipping, if any? > > >>> Most of the applets listed in Gallery are just in awn-extra, also > > >>> there are some applets contributed by some developers, awn-extras is > > >>> another different project, I tried to build it, failed, because all > > >>> of applets are in this package, some applet need different > > >>> dependencies, some of them are missing on Solaris, e.g. > > >>> python-alsaaudio. > > >> > > >> On Solaris, we support SunAudio and will hopefully soon support OSS. So > > >> any applets which depend on ALSA would obviously not work. It would be > > >> nice if we provided (at the very least) a spec-file in spec-files-extra > > >> to allow people to more easily build whatever extra plugins do work on > > >> Solaris. > > > Will do once got time.. > > >> > > >>>> Although it does look cool, I worry that it will confuse users if we > > >>>> provide another interface that works very similar to gnome-panel. I > > >>>> would appreciate more information about what our future plans are. > > >>>> Will > > >>>> avant-window-navigator replace gnome-panel, will it be used together > > >>>> with gnome-panel, or is it expected that users will pick one or the > > >>>> other to use? Perhaps you could explain a bit how you expect users > > >>>> would actually use this in relation to gnome-panel. > > >>> > > >>> Yes, It's a big concern now, we have gnome-panel, should we ship AWN? > > >>> At the moment, AWN can't replace gnome-panel, reason below: > > >>> 1, AWN need compositing support, it means before run AWN, you have to > > >>> make Compiz start, then AWN can run, so in the non-Compiz > > >>> environment, we can only use gnome-panel. > > >>> 2, There is no launch menu by default in AWN, and the AWN menu can't > > >>> updates when applications are installed. > > >>> 3, Trash in AWN is not stable enough now. > > >>> 4, maybe something others I did not dig out.. > > >> > > >> Whether we ship AWN for these reasons is obviously a business decision > > >> for the team to make. It shouldn't affect whether the ARC case is > > >> approved or not. It might make most sense to integrate it when the > > >> above issues are addressed. However, I would make sure you file bugs > > >> upstream (probably with both the AWN and gnome-panel projects) to see > > >> if we can encourage the upstream maintainers to address some of these > > >> issues (along with the a11y issues). > > >> > > >> I'd talk it over with your project team. > > > Yes, I did discuss with the project team, and I noticed they have > > > realized these issue, and discussing how to fix them, but no schedule now. > > >> > > >>>> If they are intended to be used together, then is it likely that users > > >>>> be confused by having two sets of interfaces that do very similar > > >>>> things? > > >>> > > >>> Yes, this issue also bother me, so I'd say AWN can provide some > > >>> different experience which gnome-panel can't provide, e.g. 3D.. > > >>> So if user like to taste, he can download and use it. > > >> > > >> Right. > > >> > > >>>> managers (metacity and compiz). Users can easily manage switching > > >>>> between the two because the GNOME configuration dialogs allows users to > > >>>> pick which one they will use. This way users are prevented from > > >>>> possibly trying to run both at the same time, making a more sane user > > >>>> experience. Is switching back and forth between gnome-panel and > > >>>> avant-window-navigator managed in a similar simple fashion? > > >>> > > >>> by now it's impossible to switch between them, because we can't > > >>> remove gnome-panel. > > >> > > >> Seems it would be neat to enhance the desktop so users could more easily > > >> switch between them if they wanted. > > > Yes, I agree, so in Ubuntu, they generally close the gnome-panel at the > > > bottom, and only make the top panel run, and AWN run at the bottom of > > > screen, I think we can do in this way, and it's planned that AWN will be > > > placed anywhere of screen, so in the future, we can make these 2 work > > > together better.. > > > > > >> > > >>>> Will we be integrating any of these Extra plugins with this case, or a > > >>>> separate case? Or are you just informing us that end users can install > > >>>> additional applets if they wish? > > >>> > > >>> They should be in awn-extras, it's another project, we may consider > > >>> to deliver it separately. > > >> > > >> Makes sense. > > >> > > >> Brian > > plain text document attachment (awn-project-plan.txt) > > Item Name Owner Start Date Expected Completion comments > > > > Project Plan > > > > ARC one-pager Done. > > > > ARC fast track ongoing > > > > Open Source Review done > > > > ECCN Not start > > > > Porting done > > > > spec/SUNWspec file done to spec-files-other/core > > > > copyright file done to spec-files-other/copyright > > > > G11n done need send a request to Takao.Fujiwara@Sun.COM and cc desktop-discuss@opensolaris.org > > > > launch menu, done need to send the .desktop file to calum benson, have a description of your project and why you want to put it to the menu. > > > > ARC Material not start dump -Lv/ CLI.txt(--help)/ manpage / schemas/ pkgmap > > > > manpage not start > > > > test&fix not start > > > > ======================= Not necessary ============================================== > > Cteam Checklist HenryZ Mar. 1 07 Mar. 15 07 Not necessary > > > > Contract HenryZ Mar. 20 07 Mar. 30 07 ongoing > > > > TPT HenryZ Mar. 19 07 Mar. 21 07 Done. And store at /net/solaris.eng/benet/S11/TPT/JDS/virt-manager > > > > "What's New" Form at http://releaseme.sfbay/new_features_input.html > > > > Write Test Plan PatrickG Dec. 18 06 Dec. 23 06 Done, > > > > UI review Calum Nov. 21 06 Nov. 30 06 Have sent mail to Calum, > > > > Pre-integration Test PatrickG Mar. 22 07 Apr. 15 07 Preparing by Patrick Gu > > > > A11Y testing TimM Mar. 22 07 Apr. 20 07 Need confirm from TimM > > > > L10n HelenW Dec. 25 06 Jan. 01 07 Need confirm from HelenW > > > > TOI > > > > Doc plan manpages, project plan, TPT, What's New doc(S10U) etc. > > > > Pre-integ Bug Fixing HenryZ Apr. 15 07 Apr. 30 07 B65 code freeze date is May 4 07, but there is holiday on May 1~7 > > > From Irene.Huang@sun.com Mon Aug 4 23:18:27 2008 Received: from sunmail4.singapore.sun.com (sunmail4.Singapore.Sun.COM [129.158.71.19]) by sac.sfbay.sun.com (8.13.8+Sun/8.13.8) with ESMTP id m756IQYi016785 for ; Mon, 4 Aug 2008 23:18:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nwk-avmta-2.sfbay.sun.com (nwk-avmta-2.SFBay.Sun.COM [129.145.155.6]) by sunmail4.singapore.sun.com (8.13.4+Sun/8.13.3/ENSMAIL,v2.2) with ESMTP id m756IHAq019002 for <@sunmail2sca.sfbay.sun.com:lsarc-ext@sun.com>; Tue, 5 Aug 2008 14:18:25 +0800 (SGT) Received: from pmxchannel-daemon.nwk-avmta-2.sfbay.sun.com by nwk-avmta-2.sfbay.sun.com (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-3.04 (built Jul 15 2005)) id <0K5400I076UO9200@nwk-avmta-2.sfbay.sun.com> for lsarc-ext@sun.com (ORCPT lsarc-ext@Sun.COM); Mon, 04 Aug 2008 23:18:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sineb-mail-1.sun.com ([192.18.19.6]) by nwk-avmta-2.sfbay.sun.com (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-3.04 (built Jul 15 2005)) with ESMTP id <0K5400KR76UM64C0@nwk-avmta-2.sfbay.sun.com> for lsarc-ext@sun.com (ORCPT lsarc-ext@Sun.COM); Mon, 04 Aug 2008 23:18:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: from fe-apac-06.sun.com (fe-apac-06.sun.com [192.18.19.177] (may be forged)) by sineb-mail-1.sun.com (8.13.6+Sun/8.12.9) with ESMTP id m756ILBQ012054 for ; Tue, 05 Aug 2008 06:18:21 +0000 (GMT) Received: from conversion-daemon.mail-apac.sun.com by mail-apac.sun.com (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) id <0K5400I016Q64900@mail-apac.sun.com> (original mail from Irene.Huang@Sun.COM) for lsarc-ext@Sun.COM (ORCPT lsarc-ext@Sun.COM); Tue, 05 Aug 2008 14:18:21 +0800 (SGT) Received: from [129.158.217.138] by mail-apac.sun.com (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTPSA id <0K5400BHK6UJRGHS@mail-apac.sun.com>; Tue, 05 Aug 2008 14:18:20 +0800 (SGT) Date: Tue, 05 Aug 2008 14:19:21 +0800 From: Irene Huang Subject: Re: avant-window-navigator for OpenSolaris [LSARC/2008/452 FastTrack timeout 07/22/2008] In-reply-to: <1217818561.3807.4.camel@goalie> Sender: Irene.Huang@sun.com To: Henry Zhang Cc: Brian Cameron , Shi-Ying Irene Huang , lsarc-ext@sun.com Message-id: <1217917161.18206.6.camel@goalie> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Evolution 2.22.2 Content-type: text/plain Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT X-PMX-Version: 5.4.1.325704 References: <200807160734.m6G7YjaG013861@sac.sfbay.sun.com> <48860874.7080700@sun.com> <488891A8.2000100@sun.com> <488A01F1.6020209@sun.com> <488EF7CE.3080401@sun.com> <488FCE9A.8000208@sun.com> <1217404074.29989.2.camel@goalie> <1217818561.3807.4.camel@goalie> Status: RO Content-Length: 12697 Closed as approved. --Irene On Mon, 2008-08-04 at 10:56 +0800, Irene Huang wrote: > If there's objections within 24 hours, I'd like to close this case as > approved then. > > Thanks > > --irene > On Wed, 2008-07-30 at 15:47 +0800, Irene Huang wrote: > > Hi, All > > > > I am reseting the timeout to be August 4th. > > > > --Irene > > On Wed, 2008-07-30 at 10:14 +0800, Henry Zhang wrote: > > > Hi all, > > > > > > I made some changes on the proposal to make it neat, please check. > > > Thank Brian for review... > > > > > > Regards, > > > Henry > > > > > > Henry Zhang 写道: > > > > Hi Brain, See my answer in-line, > > > > > > > > And I finished the proposal to add some change from the discussing, see > > > > attachement. > > > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > Henry > > > > > > > > Brian Cameron 写道: > > > >> > > > >> Henry: > > > >> > > > >>>> What is the accessibility impact of this new mechanism of accessing > > > >>>> "applet like things"? Does this "just work" with accessibility? If > > > >>>> not, what is our plan to make it accessible? > > > >>> > > > >>> AWN is used to manage the running task, and some applets. We can use > > > >>> Ctl+Alt+Tab to access the running task, it should be accessibility > > > >>> support. > > > >>> For the applets in AWN, no way to access them through keyboard by now. > > > >> > > > >> I think it would be good to discuss some sort of get-well plan for a11y > > > >> in the materials. > > > > > > > > These days I discussed accessibility support with the community, they > > > > confirm me that they have not consider this issue, I will try to push > > > > them to see if they can do some work on it, at least I can see they > > > > begin to think add some support so that user can access AWN by keyboard. > > > > And by now we can use Ctl+Alt+Tab to switch in the running applications, > > > > so these should be support accessibility. > > > >> > > > >>>> Also, how does this relate to gDesklets? Although giving users choice > > > >>>> to customize their desktop is a good thing, I hope we aren't going to > > > >>>> end up with a mish-mash of random eyecandy that doesn't work well or > > > >>>> integrate together. > > > >>> > > > >>> There is no confliction between gDesklets and AWN, gDesklets used to > > > >>> place the applets to desktop, AWN will run applets in its dock. The > > > >>> applets is different, for gDesklets, using .display file, while AWN > > > >>> need .desktop file in the applet package. > > > >> > > > >> Might be good to explain the relationship between gnome-panel, > > > >> gDesklets, and avant-window-navigator in the materials a bit more. > > > > Added soome explanation on Details of the proposal. > > > >> > > > >>>> Do users need to compile code to install a new applet, or are the > > > >>>> applets interpreted (e.g. Python code) so that users can just > > > >>>> install an > > > >>>> applet and it will just work without needing to do extra complicated > > > >>>> things like compile code? > > > >>> > > > >>> Yes, for Python applet, user can use awn-manager to install directly, > > > >>> no compile needed. For C, need to build and install. > > > >> > > > >> That's good to hear. You could also explain this in the materials a bit > > > >> more. > > > > > > > > Added soome explanation on Details of the proposal. > > > >> > > > >>>>> If someone develop the applet for AWN, should follow Applet > > > >>>>> Submission at http://wiki.awn-project.org/Awn_Extras:Applet_Submission > > > >>>> > > > >>>> Could you give some examples of what sorts of applets are available for > > > >>>> this framework? > > > >>> > > > >>> See http://wiki.awn-project.org/Applets:DevelopmentGuidelines, where > > > >>> list the detailed guideline on what the applet should be. > > > >>> You also can download awn-extras, there are some stable example. > > > >> > > > >> It doesn't seem like we have spent enough effort figuring out which > > > >> plugins we should/could be including by default. Wouldn't > > > >> avant-window-navigator be more useful if we shipped some plugin > > > >> features with it? > > > > They generally used to make the display effect better to look, so not > > > > necessary. > > > >> Do other distros ship any plugins with it? > > > >> Perhaps we should follow the general community lead here. Though > > > >> this could also be managed in a separate case, rather than this > > > >> case. > > > > From the webpage, the plugin is with awn-extras, so should in another > > > > project. And most of plugins are Ubuntu-special. > > > >> > > > >>>> What applets are installed by default and what do they do? > > > >>> > > > >>> Currently from what I can see, there is only 1 applet installed by > > > >>> default, it is Launch/Taskmanager, in order to add some other, have > > > >>> to use awn-extras. > > > >> > > > >> It would be nice if the case materials explained more about the one > > > >> applet that is installed by default, and what it does, in more detail. > > > > Added soome explanation on Details of the proposal. > > > > > > > >> > > > >>>> How active are third parties or individuals at creating applets? > > > >>> It really depend on the individual who like to contribute his applet > > > >>> to AWN, from what I can see, there definitely are quite some new > > > >>> applets provided by some developers. > > > >> > > > >> There sure are. I'm curious what applets other distributions might be > > > >> including by default. > > > > In AWN, by default there is only one applet, all other applets need to > > > > be added by awn-extras, I discussed with the community yesterday, they > > > > told me "There are some plans to include more applets in the core > > > > installation." > > > >> > > > >>>> I notice the Applet Gallery you describe is here: > > > >>>> http://wiki.awn-project.org/Applet_Gallery > > > >>>> > > > >>>> Which ones will we be shipping, if any? > > > >>> Most of the applets listed in Gallery are just in awn-extra, also > > > >>> there are some applets contributed by some developers, awn-extras is > > > >>> another different project, I tried to build it, failed, because all > > > >>> of applets are in this package, some applet need different > > > >>> dependencies, some of them are missing on Solaris, e.g. > > > >>> python-alsaaudio. > > > >> > > > >> On Solaris, we support SunAudio and will hopefully soon support OSS. So > > > >> any applets which depend on ALSA would obviously not work. It would be > > > >> nice if we provided (at the very least) a spec-file in spec-files-extra > > > >> to allow people to more easily build whatever extra plugins do work on > > > >> Solaris. > > > > Will do once got time.. > > > >> > > > >>>> Although it does look cool, I worry that it will confuse users if we > > > >>>> provide another interface that works very similar to gnome-panel. I > > > >>>> would appreciate more information about what our future plans are. > > > >>>> Will > > > >>>> avant-window-navigator replace gnome-panel, will it be used together > > > >>>> with gnome-panel, or is it expected that users will pick one or the > > > >>>> other to use? Perhaps you could explain a bit how you expect users > > > >>>> would actually use this in relation to gnome-panel. > > > >>> > > > >>> Yes, It's a big concern now, we have gnome-panel, should we ship AWN? > > > >>> At the moment, AWN can't replace gnome-panel, reason below: > > > >>> 1, AWN need compositing support, it means before run AWN, you have to > > > >>> make Compiz start, then AWN can run, so in the non-Compiz > > > >>> environment, we can only use gnome-panel. > > > >>> 2, There is no launch menu by default in AWN, and the AWN menu can't > > > >>> updates when applications are installed. > > > >>> 3, Trash in AWN is not stable enough now. > > > >>> 4, maybe something others I did not dig out.. > > > >> > > > >> Whether we ship AWN for these reasons is obviously a business decision > > > >> for the team to make. It shouldn't affect whether the ARC case is > > > >> approved or not. It might make most sense to integrate it when the > > > >> above issues are addressed. However, I would make sure you file bugs > > > >> upstream (probably with both the AWN and gnome-panel projects) to see > > > >> if we can encourage the upstream maintainers to address some of these > > > >> issues (along with the a11y issues). > > > >> > > > >> I'd talk it over with your project team. > > > > Yes, I did discuss with the project team, and I noticed they have > > > > realized these issue, and discussing how to fix them, but no schedule now. > > > >> > > > >>>> If they are intended to be used together, then is it likely that users > > > >>>> be confused by having two sets of interfaces that do very similar > > > >>>> things? > > > >>> > > > >>> Yes, this issue also bother me, so I'd say AWN can provide some > > > >>> different experience which gnome-panel can't provide, e.g. 3D.. > > > >>> So if user like to taste, he can download and use it. > > > >> > > > >> Right. > > > >> > > > >>>> managers (metacity and compiz). Users can easily manage switching > > > >>>> between the two because the GNOME configuration dialogs allows users to > > > >>>> pick which one they will use. This way users are prevented from > > > >>>> possibly trying to run both at the same time, making a more sane user > > > >>>> experience. Is switching back and forth between gnome-panel and > > > >>>> avant-window-navigator managed in a similar simple fashion? > > > >>> > > > >>> by now it's impossible to switch between them, because we can't > > > >>> remove gnome-panel. > > > >> > > > >> Seems it would be neat to enhance the desktop so users could more easily > > > >> switch between them if they wanted. > > > > Yes, I agree, so in Ubuntu, they generally close the gnome-panel at the > > > > bottom, and only make the top panel run, and AWN run at the bottom of > > > > screen, I think we can do in this way, and it's planned that AWN will be > > > > placed anywhere of screen, so in the future, we can make these 2 work > > > > together better.. > > > > > > > >> > > > >>>> Will we be integrating any of these Extra plugins with this case, or a > > > >>>> separate case? Or are you just informing us that end users can install > > > >>>> additional applets if they wish? > > > >>> > > > >>> They should be in awn-extras, it's another project, we may consider > > > >>> to deliver it separately. > > > >> > > > >> Makes sense. > > > >> > > > >> Brian > > > plain text document attachment (awn-project-plan.txt) > > > Item Name Owner Start Date Expected Completion comments > > > > > > Project Plan > > > > > > ARC one-pager Done. > > > > > > ARC fast track ongoing > > > > > > Open Source Review done > > > > > > ECCN Not start > > > > > > Porting done > > > > > > spec/SUNWspec file done to spec-files-other/core > > > > > > copyright file done to spec-files-other/copyright > > > > > > G11n done need send a request to Takao.Fujiwara@Sun.COM and cc desktop-discuss@opensolaris.org > > > > > > launch menu, done need to send the .desktop file to calum benson, have a description of your project and why you want to put it to the menu. > > > > > > ARC Material not start dump -Lv/ CLI.txt(--help)/ manpage / schemas/ pkgmap > > > > > > manpage not start > > > > > > test&fix not start > > > > > > ======================= Not necessary ============================================== > > > Cteam Checklist HenryZ Mar. 1 07 Mar. 15 07 Not necessary > > > > > > Contract HenryZ Mar. 20 07 Mar. 30 07 ongoing > > > > > > TPT HenryZ Mar. 19 07 Mar. 21 07 Done. And store at /net/solaris.eng/benet/S11/TPT/JDS/virt-manager > > > > > > "What's New" Form at http://releaseme.sfbay/new_features_input.html > > > > > > Write Test Plan PatrickG Dec. 18 06 Dec. 23 06 Done, > > > > > > UI review Calum Nov. 21 06 Nov. 30 06 Have sent mail to Calum, > > > > > > Pre-integration Test PatrickG Mar. 22 07 Apr. 15 07 Preparing by Patrick Gu > > > > > > A11Y testing TimM Mar. 22 07 Apr. 20 07 Need confirm from TimM > > > > > > L10n HelenW Dec. 25 06 Jan. 01 07 Need confirm from HelenW > > > > > > TOI > > > > > > Doc plan manpages, project plan, TPT, What's New doc(S10U) etc. > > > > > > Pre-integ Bug Fixing HenryZ Apr. 15 07 Apr. 30 07 B65 code freeze date is May 4 07, but there is holiday on May 1~7 > > > > > >