From gd78059@sac.sfbay.sun.com Tue Oct 27 11:07:58 2009 Received: from newsunmail1brm.central.sun.com (newsunmail1brm.Central.Sun.COM [129.147.62.245]) by sac.sfbay.sun.com (8.13.8+Sun/8.13.8) with ESMTP id n9RI7wxc012019 for ; Tue, 27 Oct 2009 11:07:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nwk-avmta-1.SFBay.Sun.COM (nwk-avmta-1.SFBay.Sun.COM [129.146.11.74]) by newsunmail1brm.central.sun.com (8.13.7+Sun/8.13.7/ENSMAIL,v2.2) with ESMTP id n9RI7s1Z031371; Tue, 27 Oct 2009 12:07:57 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pmxchannel-daemon.nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM by nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-3.04 (built Jul 15 2005)) id <0KS600A05QD7XB00@nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM>; Tue, 27 Oct 2009 11:07:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dm-sfbay-02.sfbay.sun.com ([129.146.11.31]) by nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-3.04 (built Jul 15 2005)) with ESMTP id <0KS600LONQD7X490@nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM>; Tue, 27 Oct 2009 11:07:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sac.sfbay.sun.com (sac.SFBay.Sun.COM [129.146.226.132]) by dm-sfbay-02.sfbay.sun.com (8.13.8+Sun/8.13.8/ENSMAIL,v2.4) with ESMTP id n9RI7t9w014754; Tue, 27 Oct 2009 11:07:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sac.sfbay.sun.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by sac.sfbay.sun.com (8.13.8+Sun/8.13.8) with ESMTP id n9RI7suD012014; Tue, 27 Oct 2009 11:07:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from gd78059@localhost) by sac.sfbay.sun.com (8.13.8+Sun/8.13.8/Submit) id n9RI7sCi012010; Tue, 27 Oct 2009 11:07:54 -0700 (PDT) Date: Tue, 27 Oct 2009 11:07:54 -0700 (PDT) From: "Garrett D'Amore - sun microsystems" Subject: EOF of support for expanded printing formats [PSARC/2009/586 FastTrack timeout 11/10/2009] To: PSARC-ext@sun.com Cc: Garrett.Damore@sun.com Message-id: <200910271807.n9RI7sCi012010@sac.sfbay.sun.com> Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-PMX-Version: 5.4.1.325704 Status: RO Content-Length: 3642 (This case deals with the removal of the underpinning printing infrastructure for a variety of legacy formats, other than basic postscript, ascii, and ditroff. It depends on PSARC 2009/585. Some of this -- specifically lpr -g -- was discussed in PSARC 2009/538 as well.) Template Version: @(#)sac_nextcase 1.68 02/23/09 SMI This information is Copyright 2009 Sun Microsystems 1. Introduction 1.1. Project/Component Working Name: EOF of support for expanded printing formats 1.2. Name of Document Author/Supplier: Author: Garrett D'Amore 1.3 Date of This Document: 27 October, 2009 4. Technical Description EOF of support for expanded printing formats -------------------------------------------- Historically Solaris lp/lpr has had support for a variety of printing formats that are just not commonly used anymore. As a result, other printing systems (most notably CUPS) lack support for these options. We believe it is time to EOF these formats, and the supporting back end software. Note that none of these are supported by CUPS, so this case might be implemented as part of a transition away from Solaris LP and to CUPS, or it might be delivered separately. Here's a list of the things that we would like to EOF: lpr options: -c This indicates the input file is in cifplot format. I can't find any evidence that cifplot is in use anywhere. There is no filter in Solaris to support this option for modern printers. -d Input file contains DVI format data. Note that the DVI tools supplied with TeX include a dvips converter that can convert to PostScript. Solaris lacks a native facility to convert DVI to PostScript. -f FORTAN programs. Indicates that the first character of each line is a FORTRAN carriage control character. See http://www.ibiblio.org/pub/languages/fortran/ch2-14.html for more information. In general, we believe that this is not widely used anymore. There doesn't seem to be any support for this in the PostScript filters. -g Legacy "plot(4UCB)" format data, typically produced by "graph". It is our belief that this tool, along with "spline", is not widely used, and should also be removed (filed as case PSARC 2009/585, which is a dependency for this case). -t troff .. this is the old troff (otroff) format, and is not supported by any backend filters anymore. -v raster format. This format is not supported by any backend filters in Solaris. CUPS has its own "private" raster format, and supports various bitmapped image formats natively. PostScript filters: /usr/lib/posttek This filter supports Tek 4014 format data. We don't believe this is in common use any more. /usr/lib/postmd This supports "matrix" format input. We can find no evidence that this format is used. It would be used with "lp -Tmatrix" /usr/lib/postdaisy This supports the "-Tdaisy" format with lp. (This would be the Diablo 630 daisy-wheel format, which has not been in common use for quite a long time.) /usr/lib/postdmd This supports the "-Tdmd" (Ninth edition DMD bitmap file) format. We know of of no users for this format. Note that we are not planning to remove the options related to ditroff output ("dpost", lpr -n, or "-Ttroff"). There are implications for "troff" and "man" that rely on those things, and resolving those dependencies somehow will have the be subject of any effort to replace Solaris LP with CUPS. 6. Resources and Schedule 6.4. Steering Committee requested information 6.4.1. Consolidation C-team Name: ON 6.5. ARC review type: FastTrack 6.6. ARC Exposure: open From Joerg.Schilling9ab33xy531fokus.fraunhofer.de@bounce.antispameurope.com Tue Oct 27 11:17:18 2009 Received: from sunmail5.uk.sun.com (sunmail5.UK.Sun.COM [129.156.85.165]) by sac.sfbay.sun.com (8.13.8+Sun/8.13.8) with ESMTP id n9RIHHR3012184 for ; Tue, 27 Oct 2009 11:17:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: from brm-avmta-1.central.sun.com (brm-avmta-1.Central.Sun.COM [129.147.4.11]) by sunmail5.uk.sun.com (8.13.8+Sun/8.13.8/ENSMAIL,v2.2) with ESMTP id n9RIHDBQ019992 for <@sunmail2sca.sfbay.sun.com:PSARC-ext@sun.com>; Tue, 27 Oct 2009 18:17:17 GMT Received: from pmxchannel-daemon.brm-avmta-1.central.sun.com by brm-avmta-1.central.sun.com (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-3.04 (built Jul 15 2005)) id <0KS60030HQSRDJ00@brm-avmta-1.central.sun.com> for PSARC-ext@sun.com (ORCPT PSARC-ext@sun.com); Tue, 27 Oct 2009 12:17:15 -0600 (MDT) Received: from brmea-mail-1.sun.com ([192.18.98.31]) by brm-avmta-1.central.sun.com (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-3.04 (built Jul 15 2005)) with ESMTP id <0KS600CZLQSQ3YE0@brm-avmta-1.central.sun.com> for PSARC-ext@sun.com (ORCPT PSARC-ext@sun.com); Tue, 27 Oct 2009 12:17:14 -0600 (MDT) Received: from relay44i.sun.com ([192.5.209.118]) by brmea-mail-1.sun.com (8.13.6+Sun/8.12.9) with ESMTP id n9RIAoXl020195 for ; Tue, 27 Oct 2009 18:17:14 +0000 (GMT) Received: from mmp42es.mmp.us.syntegra.com ([160.41.221.11] [160.41.221.11]) by relay44i.sun.com with ESMTP id BT-MMP-97680 for PSARC-ext@sun.com; Tue, 27 Oct 2009 18:17:13 +0000 (Z) Received: from relay45i.sun.com (relay45i.sun.com [192.5.209.94]) by mmp42es.mmp.us.syntegra.com with ESMTP id BT-MMP-24593487 for PSARC-ext@sun.com; Tue, 27 Oct 2009 18:17:13 +0000 (Z) Received: from relay02-haj2.antispameurope.com ([83.246.65.52] [83.246.65.52]) by relay4i.sun.com with ESMTP id BT-MMP-1490205 for PSARC-ext@sun.com; Tue, 27 Oct 2009 18:17:12 +0000 (Z) Received: by relay02-haj2.antispameurope.com (ASE-Secure-MTA, from userid 1000) id A52B219406A; Tue, 27 Oct 2009 19:17:11 +0100 (CET) Received: from pluto.fokus.fraunhofer.de (pluto.fokus.fraunhofer.de [195.37.77.164]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by relay02-haj2.antispameurope.com (ASE-Secure-MTA) with ESMTP id DDD6D194049; Tue, 27 Oct 2009 19:17:09 +0100 (CET) Received: from EXCHSRV.fokus.fraunhofer.de (bohr.fokus.fraunhofer.de [10.147.9.231]) by pluto.fokus.fraunhofer.de (8.14.2/8.14.2) with SMTP id n9RIHA29010503; Tue, 27 Oct 2009 19:17:10 +0100 (MET) Received: from rigel ([10.147.65.195]) by EXCHSRV.fokus.fraunhofer.de with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.3959); Tue, 27 Oct 2009 19:17:09 +0100 Date: Tue, 27 Oct 2009 19:15:28 +0100 From: Joerg.Schilling@fokus.fraunhofer.de (Joerg Schilling) Subject: Re: EOF of support for expanded printing formats [PSARC/2009/586 FastTrack timeout 11/10/2009] In-reply-to: <200910271807.n9RI7sCi012010@sac.sfbay.sun.com> Sender: Joerg.Schilling9ab33xy531fokus.fraunhofer.de@bounce.antispameurope.com To: PSARC-ext@sun.com, gd78059@sac.sfbay.sun.com Cc: Garrett.Damore@sun.com Message-id: <4ae738c0.m5TJCGew3cfL3ztf%Joerg.Schilling@fokus.fraunhofer.de> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT X-PMX-Version: 5.4.1.325704 X-Brightmail-Tracker: AAAAAA== X-Antispam: No, score=0.0/5.0, scanned in 0.642sec at (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by smf-spamd v1.3.1 - http://smfs.sf.net/ References: <200910271807.n9RI7sCi012010@sac.sfbay.sun.com> User-Agent: nail 11.22 3/20/05 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 27 Oct 2009 18:17:09.0925 (UTC) FILETIME=[B2DBE550:01CA5731] Status: RO Content-Length: 1047 "Garrett D'Amore - sun microsystems" wrote: > > PostScript filters: > /usr/lib/posttek This filter supports Tek 4014 format data. > We don't believe this is in common use any > more. > > /usr/lib/postmd This supports "matrix" format input. We can > find no evidence that this format is used. > It would be used with "lp -Tmatrix" > > /usr/lib/postdaisy This supports the "-Tdaisy" format with lp. > (This would be the Diablo 630 daisy-wheel > format, which has not been in common use for > quite a long time.) > > /usr/lib/postdmd This supports the "-Tdmd" (Ninth edition DMD > bitmap file) format. We know of of no users > for this format. What about /usr/lib/lp/postscript/* Jörg -- EMail:joerg@schily.isdn.cs.tu-berlin.de (home) Jörg Schilling D-13353 Berlin js@cs.tu-berlin.de (uni) joerg.schilling@fokus.fraunhofer.de (work) Blog: http://schily.blogspot.com/ URL: http://cdrecord.berlios.de/private/ ftp://ftp.berlios.de/pub/schily From Garrett.Damore@sun.com Tue Oct 27 11:33:42 2009 Received: from sunmail4.singapore.sun.com (sunmail4.Singapore.Sun.COM [129.158.71.19]) by sac.sfbay.sun.com (8.13.8+Sun/8.13.8) with ESMTP id n9RIXefk012452 for ; Tue, 27 Oct 2009 11:33:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nwk-avmta-1.SFBay.Sun.COM (nwk-avmta-1.SFBay.Sun.COM [129.146.11.74]) by sunmail4.singapore.sun.com (8.13.4+Sun/8.13.3/ENSMAIL,v2.2) with ESMTP id n9RIXca8021149 for <@sunmail2sca.sfbay.sun.com:PSARC-ext@sun.com>; Wed, 28 Oct 2009 02:33:39 +0800 (SGT) Received: from pmxchannel-daemon.nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM by nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-3.04 (built Jul 15 2005)) id <0KS600E1HRK13H00@nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM> for PSARC-ext@sun.com (ORCPT PSARC-ext@Sun.COM); Tue, 27 Oct 2009 11:33:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sca-es-mail-2.sun.com ([192.18.43.133]) by nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-3.04 (built Jul 15 2005)) with ESMTP id <0KS600LZ7RK0X5A0@nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM> for PSARC-ext@sun.com (ORCPT PSARC-ext@Sun.COM); Tue, 27 Oct 2009 11:33:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from fe-sfbay-09.sun.com ([192.18.43.129]) by sca-es-mail-2.sun.com (8.13.7+Sun/8.12.9) with ESMTP id n9RIXaLI010238 for ; Tue, 27 Oct 2009 11:33:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from conversion-daemon.fe-sfbay-09.sun.com by fe-sfbay-09.sun.com (Sun Java(tm) System Messaging Server 7u2-7.04 64bit (built Jul 2 2009)) id <0KS600I00R9Y1A00@fe-sfbay-09.sun.com> for PSARC-ext@Sun.COM (ORCPT PSARC-ext@Sun.COM); Tue, 27 Oct 2009 11:33:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [192.168.251.11] ([unknown] [76.93.15.33]) by fe-sfbay-09.sun.com (Sun Java(tm) System Messaging Server 7u2-7.04 64bit (built Jul 2 2009)) with ESMTPSA id <0KS600JNMRJZQQG0@fe-sfbay-09.sun.com>; Tue, 27 Oct 2009 11:33:35 -0700 (PDT) Date: Tue, 27 Oct 2009 11:33:35 -0700 From: "Garrett D'Amore" Subject: Re: EOF of support for expanded printing formats [PSARC/2009/586 FastTrack timeout 11/10/2009] In-reply-to: <4ae738c0.m5TJCGew3cfL3ztf%Joerg.Schilling@fokus.fraunhofer.de> Sender: Garrett.Damore@sun.com To: Joerg Schilling Cc: PSARC-ext@sun.com, gd78059@sac.sfbay.sun.com Reply-to: Garrett.Damore@sun.com Message-id: <4AE73CFF.2080205@sun.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT X-PMX-Version: 5.4.1.325704 References: <200910271807.n9RI7sCi012010@sac.sfbay.sun.com> <4ae738c0.m5TJCGew3cfL3ztf%Joerg.Schilling@fokus.fraunhofer.de> User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.22 (X11/20090909) Status: RO Content-Length: 1008 Joerg Schilling wrote: > "Garrett D'Amore - sun microsystems" wrote: > > >> PostScript filters: >> /usr/lib/posttek This filter supports Tek 4014 format data. >> We don't believe this is in common use any >> more. >> >> /usr/lib/postmd This supports "matrix" format input. We can >> find no evidence that this format is used. >> It would be used with "lp -Tmatrix" >> >> /usr/lib/postdaisy This supports the "-Tdaisy" format with lp. >> (This would be the Diablo 630 daisy-wheel >> format, which has not been in common use for >> quite a long time.) >> >> /usr/lib/postdmd This supports the "-Tdmd" (Ninth edition DMD >> bitmap file) format. We know of of no users >> for this format. >> > > What about /usr/lib/lp/postscript/* > Sorry, that's what I meant. Additionally, the following files in /etc/lp/fd/ postdaisy.fd postdmd.fd postmd.df postplot.fd posttek.fd Thanks. - Garrett > Jörg > > From Andrew.Gabriel@sun.com Tue Oct 27 11:52:22 2009 Received: from sunmail4.singapore.sun.com (sunmail4.Singapore.Sun.COM [129.158.71.19]) by sac.sfbay.sun.com (8.13.8+Sun/8.13.8) with ESMTP id n9RIqKbX012698 for ; Tue, 27 Oct 2009 11:52:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nwk-avmta-1.SFBay.Sun.COM (nwk-avmta-1.SFBay.Sun.COM [129.146.11.74]) by sunmail4.singapore.sun.com (8.13.4+Sun/8.13.3/ENSMAIL,v2.2) with ESMTP id n9RIqII4000696 for <@sunmail2sca.sfbay.sun.com:PSARC-ext@sun.com>; Wed, 28 Oct 2009 02:52:19 +0800 (SGT) Received: from pmxchannel-daemon.nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM by nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-3.04 (built Jul 15 2005)) id <0KS600G01SF6H200@nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM> for PSARC-ext@sun.com (ORCPT PSARC-ext@sun.com); Tue, 27 Oct 2009 11:52:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gmp-eb-inf-1.sun.com ([192.18.6.21]) by nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-3.04 (built Jul 15 2005)) with ESMTP id <0KS600LWJSF6X5B0@nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM> for PSARC-ext@sun.com (ORCPT PSARC-ext@sun.com); Tue, 27 Oct 2009 11:52:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: from fe-emea-09.sun.com (gmp-eb-lb-1-fe1.eu.sun.com [192.18.6.7] (may be forged)) by gmp-eb-inf-1.sun.com (8.13.7+Sun/8.12.9) with ESMTP id n9RIqHSV001385 for ; Tue, 27 Oct 2009 18:52:17 +0000 (GMT) Received: from conversion-daemon.fe-emea-09.sun.com by fe-emea-09.sun.com (Sun Java(tm) System Messaging Server 7u2-7.04 64bit (built Jul 2 2009)) id <0KS600200SBJCX00@fe-emea-09.sun.com> for PSARC-ext@sun.com (ORCPT PSARC-ext@sun.com); Tue, 27 Oct 2009 18:52:09 +0000 (GMT) Received: from [81.187.162.109] ([unknown] [81.187.162.109]) by fe-emea-09.sun.com (Sun Java(tm) System Messaging Server 7u2-7.04 64bit (built Jul 2 2009)) with ESMTPSA id <0KS600DDDSEWMP40@fe-emea-09.sun.com> for PSARC-ext@sun.com (ORCPT PSARC-ext@sun.com); Tue, 27 Oct 2009 18:52:09 +0000 (GMT) Date: Tue, 27 Oct 2009 18:53:10 +0000 From: Andrew Gabriel Subject: Re: EOF of support for expanded printing formats [PSARC/2009/586 FastTrack timeout 11/10/2009] In-reply-to: <200910271807.n9RI7sCi012010@sac.sfbay.sun.com> Sender: Andrew.Gabriel@sun.com To: Garrett.Damore@sun.com Cc: PSARC-ext@sun.com Message-id: <4AE74196.1040009@sun.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; CHARSET=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-PMX-Version: 5.4.1.325704 References: <200910271807.n9RI7sCi012010@sac.sfbay.sun.com> User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.23 (X11/20090929) Status: RO Content-Length: 1398 Garrett D'Amore - sun microsystems wrote: > (This case deals with the removal of the underpinning printing infrastructure > for a variety of legacy formats, other than basic postscript, ascii, and > ditroff. It depends on PSARC 2009/585. Some of this -- specifically lpr -g > -- was discussed in PSARC 2009/538 as well.) > > Note that we are not planning to remove the options related to ditroff > output ("dpost", lpr -n, or "-Ttroff"). There are implications for > "troff" and "man" that rely on those things, and resolving those dependencies > somehow will have the be subject of any effort to replace Solaris LP > with CUPS. I'm pleased about that - I have come across some customers whose use [di]troff (and groff hadn't come close to being compatible enough last time I looked), both for older docs, and for program generated typeset-quality printout. However, I don't think I've seen anyone who managed to get the printer filters working automatically. Pretty well always I'll see the customer doing something like tbl xyz | eqn | troff -mm -Tpost | dpost | lp i.e. the printing system only has to know about postscript. So I wouldn't care much about the loss of lpr -n, and lp -Ttroff, but the loss of [di]troff or dpost (and supporting files) would be much more significant. Not this case, I know, but a heads-up for any future EOF of Solaris LP system. -- Andrew From Joerg.Schilling9ab33xy531fokus.fraunhofer.de@bounce.antispameurope.com Tue Oct 27 11:54:25 2009 Received: from sunmail3mpk.sfbay.sun.com (sunmail3mpk.SFBay.Sun.COM [129.146.11.52]) by sac.sfbay.sun.com (8.13.8+Sun/8.13.8) with ESMTP id n9RIsPeK013011 for ; Tue, 27 Oct 2009 11:54:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nwk-avmta-2.sfbay.sun.com (nwk-avmta-2.SFBay.Sun.COM [129.145.155.6]) by sunmail3mpk.sfbay.sun.com (8.13.8+Sun/8.13.8/ENSMAIL,v2.4) with ESMTP id n9RIsPj8015639 for <@sunmail2sca.sfbay.sun.com:PSARC-ext@sun.com>; Tue, 27 Oct 2009 11:54:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pmxchannel-daemon.nwk-avmta-2.sfbay.sun.com by nwk-avmta-2.sfbay.sun.com (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-3.04 (built Jul 15 2005)) id <0KS600C0VSIN2400@nwk-avmta-2.sfbay.sun.com> for PSARC-ext@sun.com (ORCPT PSARC-ext@sun.com); Tue, 27 Oct 2009 11:54:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sca-ea-mail-1.sun.com ([192.18.43.24]) by nwk-avmta-2.sfbay.sun.com (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-3.04 (built Jul 15 2005)) with ESMTP id <0KS6007G8SIIKZ90@nwk-avmta-2.sfbay.sun.com> for PSARC-ext@sun.com (ORCPT PSARC-ext@sun.com); Tue, 27 Oct 2009 11:54:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: from relay11i.sun.com (ip121.net129179-4.block1.us.syntegra.com [129.179.4.121]) by sca-ea-mail-1.sun.com (8.13.7+Sun/8.12.9) with ESMTP id n9RIqmTY027201 for ; Tue, 27 Oct 2009 18:54:18 +0000 (GMT) Received: from mmp14es.mmp.us.syntegra.com ([160.41.208.14] [160.41.208.14]) by relay11i.sun.com with ESMTP id BT-MMP-5134847 for PSARC-ext@sun.com; Tue, 27 Oct 2009 18:53:50 +0000 (Z) Received: from relay14i.sun.com (relay14i.sun.com [129.179.4.124]) by mmp14es.mmp.us.syntegra.com with ESMTP id BT-MMP-429882 for PSARC-ext@sun.com; Tue, 27 Oct 2009 18:53:50 +0000 (Z) Received: from relay02-haj2.antispameurope.com ([83.246.65.52] [83.246.65.52]) by relay1i.sun.com with ESMTP id BT-MMP-166511 for PSARC-ext@sun.com; Tue, 27 Oct 2009 18:53:49 +0000 (Z) Received: by relay02-haj2.antispameurope.com (ASE-Secure-MTA, from userid 1000) id 3C3BA1940A3; Tue, 27 Oct 2009 19:53:48 +0100 (CET) Received: from pluto.fokus.fraunhofer.de (pluto.fokus.fraunhofer.de [195.37.77.164]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by relay02-haj2.antispameurope.com (ASE-Secure-MTA) with ESMTP id 0E51219407F; Tue, 27 Oct 2009 19:53:47 +0100 (CET) Received: from EXCHSRV.fokus.fraunhofer.de (bohr.fokus.fraunhofer.de [10.147.9.231]) by pluto.fokus.fraunhofer.de (8.14.2/8.14.2) with SMTP id n9RIrkVJ011178; Tue, 27 Oct 2009 19:53:47 +0100 (MET) Received: from rigel ([10.147.65.195]) by EXCHSRV.fokus.fraunhofer.de with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.3959); Tue, 27 Oct 2009 19:53:46 +0100 Date: Tue, 27 Oct 2009 19:52:04 +0100 From: Joerg.Schilling@fokus.fraunhofer.de (Joerg Schilling) Subject: Re: EOF of support for expanded printing formats [PSARC/2009/586 FastTrack timeout 11/10/2009] In-reply-to: <4AE73CFF.2080205@sun.com> Sender: Joerg.Schilling9ab33xy531fokus.fraunhofer.de@bounce.antispameurope.com To: Garrett.Damore@sun.com Cc: PSARC-ext@sun.com, gd78059@sac.sfbay.sun.com Message-id: <4ae74154.0FZZKZI/v1CGFSk6%Joerg.Schilling@fokus.fraunhofer.de> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT X-PMX-Version: 5.4.1.325704 X-Brightmail-Tracker: AAAAAA== References: <200910271807.n9RI7sCi012010@sac.sfbay.sun.com> <4ae738c0.m5TJCGew3cfL3ztf%Joerg.Schilling@fokus.fraunhofer.de> <4AE73CFF.2080205@sun.com> User-Agent: nail 11.22 3/20/05 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 27 Oct 2009 18:53:46.0078 (UTC) FILETIME=[CFDE3FE0:01CA5736] Status: RO Content-Length: 701 "Garrett D'Amore" wrote: > > What about /usr/lib/lp/postscript/* > > > > Sorry, that's what I meant. > > Additionally, the following files in /etc/lp/fd/ > > postdaisy.fd > postdmd.fd > postmd.df > postplot.fd > posttek.fd > As long as /usr/lib/lp/postscript/dpost stays usable as backend for troff it may be OK, Versatec printers are from around 1980. Jörg -- EMail:joerg@schily.isdn.cs.tu-berlin.de (home) Jörg Schilling D-13353 Berlin js@cs.tu-berlin.de (uni) joerg.schilling@fokus.fraunhofer.de (work) Blog: http://schily.blogspot.com/ URL: http://cdrecord.berlios.de/private/ ftp://ftp.berlios.de/pub/schily From Garrett.Damore@sun.com Tue Oct 27 12:01:19 2009 Received: from sunmail5.uk.sun.com (sunmail5.UK.Sun.COM [129.156.85.165]) by sac.sfbay.sun.com (8.13.8+Sun/8.13.8) with ESMTP id n9RJ1ISo013313 for ; Tue, 27 Oct 2009 12:01:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nwk-avmta-1.SFBay.Sun.COM (nwk-avmta-1.SFBay.Sun.COM [129.146.11.74]) by sunmail5.uk.sun.com (8.13.8+Sun/8.13.8/ENSMAIL,v2.2) with ESMTP id n9RJ1GAv016807 for <@sunmail2sca.sfbay.sun.com:PSARC-ext@sun.com>; Tue, 27 Oct 2009 19:01:17 GMT Received: from pmxchannel-daemon.nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM by nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-3.04 (built Jul 15 2005)) id <0KS600H03SU2MH00@nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM> for PSARC-ext@sun.com (ORCPT PSARC-ext@SUN.COM); Tue, 27 Oct 2009 12:01:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sca-es-mail-2.sun.com ([192.18.43.133]) by nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-3.04 (built Jul 15 2005)) with ESMTP id <0KS600LL5SU2X4D0@nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM> for PSARC-ext@sun.com (ORCPT PSARC-ext@SUN.COM); Tue, 27 Oct 2009 12:01:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: from fe-sfbay-09.sun.com ([192.18.43.129]) by sca-es-mail-2.sun.com (8.13.7+Sun/8.12.9) with ESMTP id n9RJ1Ea0013385 for ; Tue, 27 Oct 2009 12:01:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: from conversion-daemon.fe-sfbay-09.sun.com by fe-sfbay-09.sun.com (Sun Java(tm) System Messaging Server 7u2-7.04 64bit (built Jul 2 2009)) id <0KS600700SI5DK00@fe-sfbay-09.sun.com> for PSARC-ext@SUN.COM (ORCPT PSARC-ext@SUN.COM); Tue, 27 Oct 2009 12:01:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [192.168.251.11] ([unknown] [76.93.15.33]) by fe-sfbay-09.sun.com (Sun Java(tm) System Messaging Server 7u2-7.04 64bit (built Jul 2 2009)) with ESMTPSA id <0KS6004WZSTTJV90@fe-sfbay-09.sun.com>; Tue, 27 Oct 2009 12:01:06 -0700 (PDT) Date: Tue, 27 Oct 2009 12:01:05 -0700 From: "Garrett D'Amore" Subject: Re: EOF of support for expanded printing formats [PSARC/2009/586 FastTrack timeout 11/10/2009] In-reply-to: <4ae74154.0FZZKZI/v1CGFSk6%Joerg.Schilling@fokus.fraunhofer.de> Sender: Garrett.Damore@sun.com To: Joerg Schilling Cc: PSARC-ext@sun.com, gd78059@sac.sfbay.sun.com Reply-to: Garrett.Damore@sun.com Message-id: <4AE74371.1060507@sun.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT X-PMX-Version: 5.4.1.325704 References: <200910271807.n9RI7sCi012010@sac.sfbay.sun.com> <4ae738c0.m5TJCGew3cfL3ztf%Joerg.Schilling@fokus.fraunhofer.de> <4AE73CFF.2080205@sun.com> <4ae74154.0FZZKZI/v1CGFSk6%Joerg.Schilling@fokus.fraunhofer.de> User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.22 (X11/20090909) Status: RO Content-Length: 1020 Joerg Schilling wrote: > "Garrett D'Amore" wrote: > > >>> What about /usr/lib/lp/postscript/* >>> >>> >> Sorry, that's what I meant. >> >> Additionally, the following files in /etc/lp/fd/ >> >> postdaisy.fd >> postdmd.fd >> postmd.df >> postplot.fd >> posttek.fd >> >> > > As long as /usr/lib/lp/postscript/dpost stays usable as backend for troff > it may be OK, Versatec printers are from around 1980. > > > Yeah, the ancient 1980 stuff I don't care about. But dpost is too widely useful -- I use it from time to time actually -- I don't think it can be removed. That said, someone needs to seriously think about the -Ttroff option to lp, the -n option to lpr, and the man -t option. I think its likely that these things probably need to go away to facilitate the CUPS transition, but leave dpost in place so folks can still manually use it when they need to. (And of course, such removals are "not this case".) - Garrett > Jörg > > From Garrett.Damore@sun.com Tue Oct 27 12:04:24 2009 Received: from sunmail5.uk.sun.com (sunmail5.UK.Sun.COM [129.156.85.165]) by sac.sfbay.sun.com (8.13.8+Sun/8.13.8) with ESMTP id n9RJ4M0V013384 for ; Tue, 27 Oct 2009 12:04:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nwk-avmta-2.sfbay.sun.com (nwk-avmta-2.SFBay.Sun.COM [129.145.155.6]) by sunmail5.uk.sun.com (8.13.8+Sun/8.13.8/ENSMAIL,v2.2) with ESMTP id n9RJ4Kca018394 for <@sunmail2sca.sfbay.sun.com:PSARC-ext@sun.com>; Tue, 27 Oct 2009 19:04:21 GMT Received: from pmxchannel-daemon.nwk-avmta-2.sfbay.sun.com by nwk-avmta-2.sfbay.sun.com (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-3.04 (built Jul 15 2005)) id <0KS600C21SZ7TZ00@nwk-avmta-2.sfbay.sun.com> for PSARC-ext@sun.com (ORCPT PSARC-ext@SUN.COM); Tue, 27 Oct 2009 12:04:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sca-es-mail-2.sun.com ([192.18.43.133]) by nwk-avmta-2.sfbay.sun.com (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-3.04 (built Jul 15 2005)) with ESMTP id <0KS60073JSYUKU90@nwk-avmta-2.sfbay.sun.com> for PSARC-ext@sun.com (ORCPT PSARC-ext@SUN.COM); Tue, 27 Oct 2009 12:04:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from fe-sfbay-09.sun.com ([192.18.43.129]) by sca-es-mail-2.sun.com (8.13.7+Sun/8.12.9) with ESMTP id n9RJ46hH013686 for ; Tue, 27 Oct 2009 12:04:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from conversion-daemon.fe-sfbay-09.sun.com by fe-sfbay-09.sun.com (Sun Java(tm) System Messaging Server 7u2-7.04 64bit (built Jul 2 2009)) id <0KS600E00STCJI00@fe-sfbay-09.sun.com> for PSARC-ext@SUN.COM (ORCPT PSARC-ext@SUN.COM); Tue, 27 Oct 2009 12:04:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [192.168.251.11] ([unknown] [76.93.15.33]) by fe-sfbay-09.sun.com (Sun Java(tm) System Messaging Server 7u2-7.04 64bit (built Jul 2 2009)) with ESMTPSA id <0KS6004A3SYUJVB0@fe-sfbay-09.sun.com> for PSARC-ext@SUN.COM (ORCPT PSARC-ext@SUN.COM); Tue, 27 Oct 2009 12:04:06 -0700 (PDT) Date: Tue, 27 Oct 2009 12:04:06 -0700 From: "Garrett D'Amore" Subject: Re: EOF of support for expanded printing formats [PSARC/2009/586 FastTrack timeout 11/10/2009] In-reply-to: <4AE74196.1040009@sun.com> Sender: Garrett.Damore@sun.com To: Andrew Gabriel Cc: PSARC-ext@sun.com Reply-to: Garrett.Damore@sun.com Message-id: <4AE74426.1060604@sun.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; CHARSET=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-PMX-Version: 5.4.1.325704 References: <200910271807.n9RI7sCi012010@sac.sfbay.sun.com> <4AE74196.1040009@sun.com> User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.22 (X11/20090909) Status: RO Content-Length: 1951 Andrew Gabriel wrote: > Garrett D'Amore - sun microsystems wrote: >> (This case deals with the removal of the underpinning printing >> infrastructure >> for a variety of legacy formats, other than basic postscript, ascii, and >> ditroff. It depends on PSARC 2009/585. Some of this -- specifically >> lpr -g >> -- was discussed in PSARC 2009/538 as well.) >> > >> Note that we are not planning to remove the options related to ditroff >> output ("dpost", lpr -n, or "-Ttroff"). There are implications for >> "troff" and "man" that rely on those things, and resolving those >> dependencies >> somehow will have the be subject of any effort to replace Solaris LP >> with CUPS. > > I'm pleased about that - I have come across some customers whose use > [di]troff (and groff hadn't come close to being compatible enough last > time I looked), both for older docs, and for program generated > typeset-quality printout. > > However, I don't think I've seen anyone who managed to get the printer > filters working automatically. Pretty well always I'll see the > customer doing something like > > tbl xyz | eqn | troff -mm -Tpost | dpost | lp > > i.e. the printing system only has to know about postscript. > > So I wouldn't care much about the loss of lpr -n, and lp -Ttroff, but > the loss of [di]troff or dpost (and supporting files) would be much > more significant. > > Not this case, I know, but a heads-up for any future EOF of Solaris LP > system. I agree wholeheartedly with you. I always manually stick dpost in my pipeline too. One would think we ought to be able to do better than that with cups, but really, hard copy troff is kind of an edge case these days, and so a pipeline option isn't too bad. (There are crufty unix people like me who still use it -- and PSARC members! -- but its not really mainstream anymore except for use in on-line man pages, and that's not normally done in hard copy.) - Garrett From Sebastien.Roy@sun.com Wed Nov 4 07:49:03 2009 Received: from sunmail2sca.sfbay.sun.com (sunmail2sca.SFBay.Sun.COM [129.145.155.234]) by sac.sfbay.sun.com (8.13.8+Sun/8.13.8) with ESMTP id nA4Fn3aG001969 for ; Wed, 4 Nov 2009 07:49:03 -0800 (PST) Received: from nwk-avmta-1.SFBay.Sun.COM (nwk-avmta-1.SFBay.Sun.COM [129.146.11.74]) by sunmail2sca.sfbay.sun.com (8.13.8+Sun/8.13.8/ENSMAIL,v2.4) with ESMTP id nA4Fn1wH029748 for <@sunmail2sca.sfbay.sun.com:PSARC-ext@sun.com>; Wed, 4 Nov 2009 07:49:02 -0800 (PST) Received: from pmxchannel-daemon.nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM by nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-3.04 (built Jul 15 2005)) id <0KSL0064LD9Q0100@nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM> for PSARC-ext@sun.com (ORCPT PSARC-ext@Sun.COM); Wed, 04 Nov 2009 07:49:02 -0800 (PST) Received: from brmea-mail-4.sun.com ([192.18.98.36]) by nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-3.04 (built Jul 15 2005)) with ESMTP id <0KSL00LPWD9QSZA0@nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM> for PSARC-ext@sun.com (ORCPT PSARC-ext@Sun.COM); Wed, 04 Nov 2009 07:49:02 -0800 (PST) Received: from fe-amer-10.sun.com ([192.18.109.80]) by brmea-mail-4.sun.com (8.13.6+Sun/8.12.9) with ESMTP id nA4Fn1pN007846 for ; Wed, 04 Nov 2009 15:49:02 +0000 (GMT) Received: from conversion-daemon.mail-amer.sun.com by mail-amer.sun.com (Sun Java(tm) System Messaging Server 7u2-7.04 64bit (built Jul 2 2009)) id <0KSL00K00D4SR900@mail-amer.sun.com> for PSARC-ext@Sun.COM (ORCPT PSARC-ext@Sun.COM); Wed, 04 Nov 2009 08:49:01 -0700 (MST) Received: from [129.148.174.103] ([unknown] [129.148.174.103]) by mail-amer.sun.com (Sun Java(tm) System Messaging Server 7u2-7.04 64bit (built Jul 2 2009)) with ESMTPSA id <0KSL005IYD9CZV50@mail-amer.sun.com>; Wed, 04 Nov 2009 08:48:48 -0700 (MST) Date: Wed, 04 Nov 2009 10:46:14 -0500 From: Sebastien Roy Subject: Re: EOF of support for expanded printing formats [PSARC/2009/586 FastTrack timeout 11/10/2009] In-reply-to: <200910271807.n9RI7sCi012010@sac.sfbay.sun.com> Sender: Sebastien.Roy@sun.com To: "Garrett D'Amore - sun microsystems" Cc: PSARC-ext@sun.com, Garrett.Damore@sun.com Message-id: <1257349574.26975.9.camel@strat> Organization: Sun Microsystems MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-PMX-Version: 5.4.1.325704 References: <200910271807.n9RI7sCi012010@sac.sfbay.sun.com> Status: RO Content-Length: 10 +1 -Seb From gdamore@sun.com Wed Nov 11 13:18:36 2009 Received: from sunmail5.uk.sun.com (sunmail5.UK.Sun.COM [129.156.85.165]) by sac.sfbay.sun.com (8.13.8+Sun/8.13.8) with ESMTP id nABLIaCp007114 for ; Wed, 11 Nov 2009 13:18:36 -0800 (PST) Received: from nwk-avmta-1.SFBay.Sun.COM (nwk-avmta-1.SFBay.Sun.COM [129.146.11.74]) by sunmail5.uk.sun.com (8.13.8+Sun/8.13.8/ENSMAIL,v2.2) with ESMTP id nABLIZh7003410 for <@sunmail2sca.sfbay.sun.com:PSARC-ext@sun.com>; Wed, 11 Nov 2009 21:18:35 GMT Received: from pmxchannel-daemon.nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM by nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-3.04 (built Jul 15 2005)) id <0KSY00103R6YBO00@nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM> for PSARC-ext@sun.com (ORCPT PSARC-ext@sun.com); Wed, 11 Nov 2009 13:18:34 -0800 (PST) Received: from sca-es-mail-2.sun.com ([192.18.43.133]) by nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-3.04 (built Jul 15 2005)) with ESMTP id <0KSY00DG5R6Y6U90@nwk-avmta-1.sfbay.Sun.COM> for PSARC-ext@sun.com (ORCPT PSARC-ext@sun.com); Wed, 11 Nov 2009 13:18:34 -0800 (PST) Received: from fe-sfbay-09.sun.com ([192.18.43.129]) by sca-es-mail-2.sun.com (8.13.7+Sun/8.12.9) with ESMTP id nABLIY9M007267 for ; Wed, 11 Nov 2009 13:18:34 -0800 (PST) Received: from conversion-daemon.fe-sfbay-09.sun.com by fe-sfbay-09.sun.com (Sun Java(tm) System Messaging Server 7u2-7.04 64bit (built Jul 2 2009)) id <0KSY00200R3UZJ00@fe-sfbay-09.sun.com> for PSARC-ext@sun.com (ORCPT PSARC-ext@sun.com); Wed, 11 Nov 2009 13:18:34 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.251.11] ([unknown] [76.93.15.33]) by fe-sfbay-09.sun.com (Sun Java(tm) System Messaging Server 7u2-7.04 64bit (built Jul 2 2009)) with ESMTPSA id <0KSY00EE8R6VZNB0@fe-sfbay-09.sun.com> for PSARC-ext@sun.com (ORCPT PSARC-ext@sun.com); Wed, 11 Nov 2009 13:18:31 -0800 (PST) Date: Wed, 11 Nov 2009 13:18:30 -0800 From: "Garrett D'Amore" Subject: PSARC 2009/586 EOF of support for expanded printing formats Sender: Garrett.Damore@sun.com To: PSARC-ext Message-id: <4AFB2A26.9040709@sun.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; CHARSET=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-PMX-Version: 5.4.1.325704 User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.22 (X11/20090909) Status: RO Content-Length: 110 This case, which depends on upon 2009/585, was approved at PSARC today (along with 2009/585.) - Garrett